On Writing : Ask Me Anything (AMA) 10/11 to 10/12- The Publishing Process & Industry by Jonathan Jordan

Congratulations on all the success, Jonathan Jordan! Thanks for taking the time to have this AMA. I'm definitely interested in hearing the pros/cons of self-publishing vs. other routes.

Hi there! Thanks for being here! I love all your suggested questions! What do you need to do to get an agent? It always seems a catch-22 for agents and managers!

Maurice Vaughan sure thing, one of the biggest discussions obviously! I'll try to keep this as brief as possible but happy to expound on any point needed...

SELF-PUBLISHING (including Digital Publishing here)

Pros:

-Low barrier to entry. Pretty much anyone can do it.

-Retain full rights and control over your material.

-Higher royalties for sales compared to other routes.

-Good way to start building readership for longer-term goals/projects.

-Shorter timeline, less red tape.

Cons:

-Since anyone can do it, hard to stand out.

-Everything is on your shoulders. You'll need to hire cover designer, layout designer, editor, proofreader. Doing it all alone is not advisable or best for a good product.

-Limited distribution channels.

-You're 100% responsible for all marketing, getting reviews, etc.

-Since some people in industry look down on self-pub, it can be a barrier to being taken seriously for other publishing routes. Not always, but can be.

HYBRID PUBLISHING (aka Independent Publishing)

Pros:

-Can be a good credibility builder, depending on the brand of publisher.

-Retain full rights usually.

-Higher royalties than trade pub, but not as high as self-pub.

-More distribution channels available, comparable to trade.

-Support: provides designers, editors, ets. Some even provide some limited marketing support.

Cons:

-High cost. This is pay-to-play. You're looking at spending $25K to $250K depending on publisher and the package.

-As such, you're unlikely to recoup cost through book sales, so this is more for nonfiction where you can leverage the book for other purposes. Example: I've had clients whose books helped them bring in $100K+ clients for their business or land speaking gigs, so it was worth the investment for them.

-You'll still be responsible for a lot of the marketing efforts, even if they provide some support with things like reviews, promos, or industry connections.

TRADITIONAL PUBLISHING (aka Trade Pub)

Pros:

-This is the dream, right? Credibility of being picked up by a major publisher, especially if you land a deal with one of the Big 5.

-Low cost for you. They largely cover cost of design, editing, and distribution. Some medium/smaller trade publishers do ask for you to foot part of editing cost.

Cons:

-High barrier to entry. Often need an agent (especially for fiction) or killer book proposal and name recognition (for nonfiction).

-Have to give up rights, control. Ex: Some trade published authors don't even get to pick their own book cover.

-Lower royalties with no guarantee you'll be a bestseller. Don't quit your day job. Few trade authors make enough from royalties to live off it.

-Most of the marketing is on you. This is biggest shock for many. Trade publishers spend their marketing budget on the big names. You'll be expected to do much of the work on your own though they may offer some support, plus the credibility factor.

-If book doesn't sell well, they can pull it from print, unlikely another trade publisher will pick it up.

None of these routes are better than another. You have to look at YOUR goals for your book and decide which route aligns best. You can find scammers lurking in any of these, too. Not everyone who says they're a trade publisher actually is...if they're asking you to pay, they're not trade. A legit hybrid publisher is very up front about this. Hope this helps!

Xochi Blymyer the best thing you can do for getting an agent is to start getting your work out into the world and build some credibility. A good friend of mine just got an agent and sold her debut novel to a Big 5 Publisher. The way she did it was spending the past couple of years sending short stories and flash fiction in for competitions and online journals. She won a couple of writing awards, got published in a couple of journals, and was about to put this in her query letters. So if you've got short fiction, this is a great way to leverage it.

As far as queries go: Focus on querying agents in your genre...all good agents have a list of what they're looking for, so don't waste your (or their) time querying someone who doesn't read your genre. Personalize every query to the agent, highlight what you would add to the market. Go listen to "The Shit No One Tells You About Writing" podcast. Two of the co-hosts are both agents and are very open about what they look for and how to write query letters. They even critique real-life queries on the show so you can pick up tips!

Great breakdown, Jonathan Jordan! I saved this info in case I write a book. Thanks!

You're very welcome, Maurice!

Thank you for taking the time to answer our questions today, Jonathan Jordan! What advice would you give to aspiring authors who get too caught up in perfectionism and let it stop them from completing a first draft?

Hey Jonathan Jordan! Thanks for doing this AMA! I get a lot of writers who reach out with great stories based on their personal lives and want to know how to write them (whether it be a book, movie, or series). What advice do you have for anyone interested in writing their first memoir? How will they know if it's a story that is ready to be written down?

@Ashley Renee Smith, the bite of perfectionism is REAL and kills so many projects. We tend to be our own worst enemy. What I tell myself and my clients is simple: "No one sees the first draft." The best action is to power through and get the "vomit draft" out of you. Imagine if we expected perfection from any other profession. No one would get anywhere. And to echo the words of Jodi Picoult, "You can't edit a blank page." Rewriting and editing is where the real magic happens!

@Emily J great, great, great question about memoirs.

My first bit of advice here is getting to the Why of the personal story as it relates to future readers. Who is going to benefit from hearing this story? How are you hoping to serve them? Too many people want to write memoirs just as a way to talk about themselves, but that's not the point of a memoir. The point is to serve the reader. This question often reveals they haven't even thought through what they want to accomplish by sharing their story or if they would even have a readership.

The second piece is how long ago it happened. It's hard to write objectively about what happened last week or even last year. The question is, "Have you adequately healed from the events for you to be able to pass on the healing?"

If a writer has a very clear picture of (1) who will benefit and (2) has enough objective distance to be helpful to others, then they may be ready!

Hi Jonathan Jordan - thanks a ton for doing this AMA. What do you think the future holds for self/vanity/trad publishing? Will the trend skew towards one or another? Thanks in advance!

Thanks much, Jonathan for that easy-to-get delineation among the various ways to publish. Having done it myself both with a legacy industry publisher (4 books) and self-publishing (3 books) it is good to have the much higher profits and control in the latter, but the prestige gained from the former goes a long way to as you say, be seen as "legit" and it certainly opened a lot of doors to speaking, teaching, and traveling for same.

Hi again, Jonathan. A question please about the Memoirs. I do so like your main points about who will benefit and objectivity. Additionally, might you comment please on how true to stay to the (presumed, perceived) "Truth" and how much poetic license to take. Some writers seem to insist that everything go into the story and it goes in a certain way because -- "that's the way it happened". Plus we've seen some of those scandals when someone made up part of their true story. So basically, 1) How true should one stay to what actually happened? and 2) How much of the whole story needs to be in the memoir?

And one more question please Jonathan about legalities in Memoirs. How do you know when to get Releases from people (or their heirs) who might be recognizable to others and might not like how you have presented them? Also, do you need to worry about including brand names or companies? Thank you so much for sharing your experience and expertise with us.

Leonardo Ramirez my crystal ball tends to be a bit dusty, but I don't think any of these are going away any time soon. They exist in a pretty nice balance right now because they appeal to different audiences and authors. People talk about trade publishing being in trouble, but for the most part, that's not what I'm seeing. They are still very much needed for setting the standards across the industry. Hybrid will only become more popular as more people discover its potential.

@Pamela Jaye Smith, you bring up some important points for memoir which are definitely important to consider sooner than later in the process. 1) Obviously, you should stay as true as possible, but true to your perspective. US law has been pretty consistent in a number of cases that an author cannot be charged with libel for expressing their personal view about a situation, it's covered under the 1st Amendment. Can't speak to other countries and their libel laws, but that's what's been true here. I've had clients who chose to change certain names and minor details, though, as a safeguard and so they wouldn't have to get releases from those individuals. Even so, they are being true to the events and how they were impacted. 2) Kind of up to the author, but it's important to distinguish between autobiography which covers the span of an entire life vs. memoir which may just cover a certain theme or season of life. A good example would be a former President writing about their time in office. They may include some details from childhood that are relevant, but it's a memoir of their Presidency, not an autobiography, if that makes sense. 3) Best to think of releases as early as possible. Again, you don't technically need them for a memoir because the law has largely supported authors' intent and freedom of speech. A couple memoirs I've worked on did zero releases, though they did take some other measures. Still, it's definitely something I encourage, especially if you're sharing information that's been presented elsewhere. For instance, a recent client has been letting guests on his podcast know he's writing a book and had them sign a release in case he wants to use a quote from them since it would be crossing from one medium (podcast) to another (book).

Hi Jonathan, thanks for doing this AMA! WOuld you talk a bit about how you got into ghostwriting? And what you love and don't love about it?

Niki H happy to do so! It started with editing a book for a friend. There were large portions of the book which were just a bunch of survey responses she gave me and they needed to be turned into narratives. It was just easier for me to write these myself in the editing process, but that was my first taste of ghostwriting! Then I had a developmental editing gig where I would write example paragraphs for the author to emulate and learn from. After that, I had a pretty decent portfolio of work to leap into ghostwriting entire books.

What I love about it: I get to meet some really cool people with great ideas and it gives me the chance to learn topics I wouldn't typically seek out on my own. From a screenwriting perspective, it's a great dialogue exercise because you're writing an entire book in someone else's voice! There are also more opportunities and as you gain experience, you can make pretty decent money from it. I started ghostwriting full time last year because I could make more from it than my 9-5 media sales job.

What I don't love about it: Like any freelancing, it can be a roller coaster. Sometimes I'm overloaded with work, sometimes I wonder where the heck everyone is. There are a lot of elements out of my control, like a client showing up on time or dragging out the revisions process, which then affects when I get paid. sigh Also, I had to learn a lot on my own through trial and error. While there are a few resources out there to learn how to ghostwrite as a business, most of them focus more on the business side and not so much on the actual ghostwriting. I'm actually developing a curriculum now to help correct this training gap in the industry!

Hi Jonathan Jordan, thanks for taking time to answer all these questions! On the topic of memoirs, what differs in book proposal materials for memoirs versus fiction?

Hi Jonathan Jordan! So great to see you doing an AMA! I wanted to jump in here to say to Pamela Jaye Smith (and everyone else) that the rules are very, very different when it comes to what I work on, which is scripted TV. If you adapt your (or someone else's) memoir into a fictionalized series, completely different legal rules apply. And a question for you! I am an independent producer and script/pitch consultant in scripted TV. A lot of my clients ask me if it would help if they wrote a novel first and then adapted it to a TV series. What I have heard on this topic is that the barrier to entry for novels getting published is very high, so writing a story as short fiction that could be published in a magazine is a better bet. Do you agree? In TV, prose IP is only valuable if it has already received some kind of stamp of approval, either awards or established readership, which means that a self-published novel itself has no value. Are there opportunities in short fiction publishing to get those results?

Hi Jonathan Jordan - thank you so much for being here today in the community for this AMA! My question is on book proposals. I've heard mixed things - that to present to a publisher you need 3 chapters and an outline, or just four chapters and a list of chapters. What do you think is the best package to put together to approach publishers with a book proposal? Thanks!

Hey Jonathan Jordan

This is really cool of you to do for us, so thanks for your time and efforts here. I originally popped in to ask questions about a fantasy novel I'm in the final stages of, but it turns out I'm a lead editor for a friend's memoir this year, and since you have experience...

I feel this is a memoir that's going to catch people's attention. The story is wild, the writing is honest and raw, compelling. We're in the later editing stages, and I'm going to be looking at publishing options in the near future. I have a basic understanding of the process, so I guess what I'd love is your take on some pitfalls to avoid, and best practices to strive for, when it comes to publishing. What wisdom can you bestow upon me as I look to bring this project out into the world?

And once again, thanks so much for your time. I couldn't be more grateful to have a chance to ask for your advice.

David Abrookin fiction doesn't need a full proposal with graphics, etc. Just your standard query letter introducing yourself, any accolades, your story, and the comps. As mentioned in a previous answer, go listen to "The Shit No One Tells You About Writing," most of their episodes deal with fiction queries though they've covered memoir before too. With memoir, you need all these pieces for the query too, but think of the book proposal similar to a pitch deck for TV. There should be graphics and additional info about the subject so people can get a sense of who they are as a person and why their story matters. On this point, there should be a special emphasis on answering, "Why this story right NOW?" Urgency sells. Ex: a memoir about a Ukrainian baker serving the troops will have more urgency/marketability than a memoir about a Polish baker doing the same thing in WW2.

@Anne Marton Henry, appreciate the observation on TV...yes, very very different with the legal rules, so that's great to note. As for short fiction, yes it's easier to get short fiction published, at least, digitally. It's very difficult to traditionally publish a collection of short stories. Publishers only do that if you've already had some success as a novelist. But there's a TON of opportunity to publish short fiction online in literary journals, short fiction and flash fiction contests. As I mentioned in a previous answer, a good friend of mine scored her agent and current book deal with Simon & Schuster because she spent the last year getting her short fiction published online and winning a couple of awards. The problem here is a misunderstanding about what qualifies as valuable IP. Screenwriters often think, "Hey producers want IP so I'll go turn my script into a book and then they'll want it." But that's just not how it works. So you're 100% right in the advice you're giving.

@Sam Sokolow yes, you're going to continue to get mixed advice on book proposals because everyone has a slightly different take on it. That's because publishers have different standards when they're considering the proposals...some will ask for 3 chapters, others 4, etc. For starters, you really only need a book proposal for nonfiction. Fiction just uses queries, at least in my experience. But if you're pitching nonfiction and a publisher asks for a proposal after the initial query, then you need a visually-engaging doc kind of like a pitch deck, 4-5 pages, but not heavy on text, focusing on the subject matter and the marketability. Have at least a solid 3 chapters ready to go, but I'd suggest having 50% of the book done just in case you get that cantankerous publisher who wants to see more, as well as both a detailed outline (5-10 pages) and a one-sheet chapter breakdown, that way you can mix and match based on what a publisher wants to see.

Jonathan Jordan Thank you so much! Are there lists of the best online magazines to approach and/or legitimate contests to enter? Particularly the latter - I know on the TV side there are contests that carry particular prestige. My apologies if this is the most naive question on this thread, I am just starting to wade into this particular pond. ;)

Lawrence Davidson sounds awesome, best of luck!

Some pitfalls to avoid...when pitching, be realistic with the comps. For example, if I'm pitching a middle-grade fantasy series, it would be a mistake to say, "for fans of Harry Potter and Percy Jackson." These are such huge hits, it will make an agent or acquiring editor roll their eyes and form the opinion you have unrealistic expectations. So you want to pick comps to reference that were successful, but not TOO successful...if that makes sense. This is contrary to comps in TV/film pitches where you would reference the big hit. Another pitfall is to be cautious about mixing media in your comps. Try to stick with comping from book titles, not movies/TV. There can be exceptions to this, though. For instance, "In many ways, Arjun's story is like a real-life telling of SLUMDOG MILLIONAIRE." But do so sparingly and only if it makes sense.

Best practices: Make sure you mention any accolades or audience the author has. For instance, "She has four million followers on Instagram," or "She was interviewed by TIME Magazine," or "He won a national award for social work," etc. Agents and publishers will be drawn to someone who has a developed audience to leverage. Make sure to put emphasis on why NOW for the book. Why is it relevant in the current zeitgeist? Also pay attention to what kind of books the agent/publisher specializes in. Don't waste your time querying people who don't specialize in memoir. I know that sounds obvious, but this mistake happens a lot for newer writers who assume they just need to blast anyone and everyone. Also, keep the query on the shorter side. 300-400 words is plenty. Agents and acquisitions editors are super busy slogging through pitches so you'll stand out to them more if you respect their time through a shorter word count.

@Anna Marton Henry, a couple good places to start... PW.org and Writer's Digest. There are lots of other legit ones, of course, but these are the first two that spring to mind!

Hey, Jonathan Jordan! Loving this thread - thank you so much for your in-depth answers! If I can sneak two more questions in under the wire, they would be:

1) Have you seen independent publishers offer packages like the audiobooks on ACX? It's usually one of three packages - pay all up front so you retain all the rights, pay part upfront and release a small percentage of the profits, OR pay nothing upfront and relinquish a hefty heap of the profits. If you have seen this for book publishing, do you feel this is a fair deal for up-and-coming writers? Or is there a better way to pursue independent publishing?

2) More and more authors seem to be enlisting the talents of film&video producers, not to convert their IP, but to create book trailers and teasers. Would you recommend book trailers for authors? If so, do you have any examples of successful/professional ones?

THANKS SO MUCH!

Karen "Kay" Ross 1) I've seen some of this, yes. More publishers are adding audiobook options to their packages and generally speaking, the model you describe is pretty fair as it aligns with the rest of the industry. For instance, if you traditionally publish your book, the publisher is fronting the costs for production/distribution, so it's only fair they recoup through the royalties. For up-and-coming writers who are self-publishing or digitally publishing, I'd encourage them to look into audio. I've recorded one book on ACX as an experiment to learn the process and after some initial frustration, it wasn't too difficult. The best thing a new writer can do, though, is start audience building by getting your work out there: lit journals, WattPad, Vella, Medium, short fiction/poetry contests, whatever. No matter what route you end up publishing, you won't get much of anywhere if you don't start building credibility.

2) Yes, I'd definitely recommend a book trailer. Leveraging video is the newest trend in book marketing. Check out this one as a decent example because it's short, sets the tone of the book, and knows its audience: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UbsNfwkZwk It's definitely worth using video to market your book, but you need to have a great plan in place to be successful. I'm no expert in that particular arena, but the poet Shelby Leigh has done really well using video to promote her books and even landed a traditional publishing deal because of it. "BookTok" is totally a thing now and while it's not my personal cup of tea, new writers with no audience should study up on how to successfully promote via video. Shelby now offers some online courses that are pretty affordable for learning how to do this. https://www.marketingbyshelby.com/

Thanks for your cogent and helpful answers about Memoirs, Jonathan. I'll definitely keep those things in mind. Recently I heard someone reply to the question, "When are you going to write your memoir?" with a rather humorous (or maybe totally serious) reply -- "As soon as the Statue of Limitations is up". But as you noted, with some thoughtfulness to the approach a writer should be able to avoid those sorts of problems. Thanks again!

Hi Jonthan , I just finished my first book ( a collection of 3 memoirs ) with a ghost writer . I have the final script ready . However I am not happy . And need a help of professional to bring it to the next level . I am open to all suggestions and changes .

Best regards,

Tariq