Screenwriting : Baseball Film by Dennis Klein

I agree with Lyse. Taking a break from something and working on something else can do wonders for perspective. It also gives you a chance to see how something might work in another script and possibly apply what you've learned to the first.

Personally, I really love the challenge of editing down word counts. At first not so much. But after doing all my writing on facebook posts, then 500-word blog posts, then submitting stories with a 300-word limit, I developed a taste for it. It's helped me in keeping my script page count low-- currently 85 pages, enough wriggle room to develop characters a bit more. What makes your script so long? Too wordy? Too many characters? Too much plot? Scenes run a bit long? If you're not sure you could post your first ten pages here and get some feedback/advice.

Thank you all for all the good advice. I will work on what you all said. Richard, thanks for you comment. I did just that and recently came back to rewriting "Hall of Fame." Best to all of you in your endeavors.

War and Peace and War and Obama's speech's 222 pages

American President's first draft was 250 pages, and Larry Karaszewski & Scott Alexander talk about how their first drafts are routinely 200 pages. But...you do have to cut that down by about 110 pages. I'm happy to help, bu honestly, the extra pages fees I charge would be way too high. So I hope you can find someone on here to help you edit down..

Before you write your second screenplay (and you probably will) read Save the Cat. It will force you to build a shorter drive-train. Build your world by page 5, By page 10 something important needs to happen like the discovery of a new opportunity. By page 25 you are done with act 1. Your characters should start working towards their new goal until the half way point at Page 55. That's where they run into problems, the obstacle changes their course or a new goal is discovered. That happens up to page 85 or the start of act 3. All hope is lost here. Then there is a surprising resolution and closure. Everything is wrapped up in a pretty bow at page 110. Because you are at 222 pages, you are looking at a page 1 rewrite either way (screenplay or novel at this point). Build a strong Drive-train of the story to fit the model above and then start - over. Welcome to writing... UGH. This isn't unusual. I think a lot of new screenwriters just sit down and write ... that's how they get into trouble. Outline, Outline, Outline and then Outline again making sure it fits into the Drive-Train. Then simply fill in the blanks. You will be happier for it ... trust me.

Hi Dennis. I feel your pain. First draft of my second screenplay came in at 185 pages. It was based on a true story so it was difficult to take things out, especially since I worked so hard on the scenes I eliminated. I did get it down to 113 pages and it's all the better for it. What you can cut usually strengthens what remains. Take a break and look it over in a few weeks. If you've written something that doesn't move the story forward, no matter how 'married' you are too it, get out the chainsaw. You can always put it back in if you feel you need to. I'm with Stacy on outline. Good luck!

Hi Dennis, I've done a bit of script supervising and continuity and have seen a few scripts here and there. If you haven't done it already, edit out all of the description and character "state of mind/action" paragraphs and see if that helps. What I mean by that is if you have any passages that read "He looked at a her with a look that told her exactly what she needed to know, he shared her pain. She looked back at him to acknowledge his look, with a look of her own that said..." (I know, this a bit of a silly extreme example and I've seen it done!)

First: a shared credit on a script that isn't going to sell isn't worth much. Baseball is not an easy sell, Soccer would be better. Second: Write up a logline that focuses on the one conflict at the center of your story. Now cut any scene or character which is not part of that conflict. But the best thing to do: write another script, then another script,m then another script. If the average pro screenwriter didn't make a cent until they wrote 9 scripts, write 8 more and you'll probably be getting them to 110 pages.

Speaking as a baseball nut--I wouldn't listen to changing your topic. Baseball is extremely nuanced in ways non-fans don't always appreciate. Besides, I just had a short story accepted that's going into a baseball erotica anthology--so it may not be hot in Hollywood (if you believe @William), but it's hot for horny readers. Don't give up on your story--just trim the excess fat.

The first screenplay I wrote was 240 pages or so. It was nothing but plot and was of only average interest. I was advised by others to cut, cut, cut, but I wanted to tell the whole story of my subject. What I eventually did was break it up into three scripts and added a lot of character development to the story. I had room to develop how they felt about their situation and each other. It is now a little over 300 pages total over three scripts and a better story. Movies might be a visual medium, but it’s the passion and emotion that really drives the story. I have little interest in stories that lack genuine emotion. Find the passion/emotion in your story, or any other story you write, and write that. Whether you cut it or expand it as I did with mine. But baseball is probably a niche subject, as my story probably is. Mostly only people who have an interest in the subject would go to see it. Which wold make it a harder sell, especially if you expand it to 3 scripts. -- But good, genuine, well-written emotion will go a long way toward making ANY script universal. It's the emotion that we relate to most. It helps us identify with characters in situations that are otherwise foreign to us. By the way, I would pay my good money to see a good baseball movie with real emotion, and I don't go to movies much anymore. Just as I would pay good money to see my story.

I agree with Lisa Scott. Screenplays are all about saying as much as possible with as few words as possible. Seriously, screenplays are not the stuff of "excessive fluff". If you're doing it right there will be lots of white-space to make it easy to read, the dialogue will be sparse and my favourite trick is to allow only 3 words to describe ANTHING and ANYONE. Pick your priorities about your details. If your story is strong enough, your creative integrity will withstand some contribution and allow for some changes due to production time, casting, budget, locations etc... Films are a collaborative art. Screenwriters are creators of the work for everyone! But! You must allow directors room to interpret, Actors will bring a flavour to the charactor, set designers enhance the details in the surroundings, cinematographers contribute depth and visual artistry, sound techs add another layer. Screenwriting is just as much about what you leave out as what you put in. I think Lisa is right, if it's that difficult for you to stick to 120-140 pages you should be writing a novel ... you could be the next J.K Rowling and you don't even know it ...

Just a note: the average studio film costs $106.7 million by the time it hits your screen. That's not a summer blockbuster, that's an average film. So think of every page costing $1m. Is this page worth $1m? Also: Movies are an international biz (and have been forever). only 1/3rd of a movie's income is from the USA (since the early 70s, nothing new). So subjects that only appeal to a US audience are not a good choice.

Marisa if you mean the things your saying.. YOU GET IT! A screenwriter should not go in to detail about the room or the characters looks.. that's not our job .. That's the casting director and set designers job. I've read some of the award winning screenplays .. they are novels. The screenplay is a film drawing. get to the point.. tell the story .. let the producer do the rewrites let the pros do their thing. No camera angles PLEASE I got James frickin Hong to shot do . I really need you the screenwriters opinion LOL

WILLIAM - nothing against you but I every time I hear that cliche thing about every page costing $1M, I shake my head. Until they actually start paying screenwriters $1M a page that reference is 100% BS. Using the same logic I could say that the Gaffer dude better screw in those lights like it's worth $106M (what does that break down per bulb). See what I'm sayin? How about that PA who gets my coffee. What's each of those trips to Starbucks worth divided by $106M? I want to find whom ever started this saying and punch them. Their math sucks.

That was a pile of opinion without any actual math involved. Average cost of a movie: $106.m. Usual number of pages for a screenplay: 110 or fewer. Simple division: each page is going to average around $1m to film. Now please show me, using math rather than opinion, how that is incorrect.

William don't know where you got 110 million. All the budget of a film does not go into making the film, maybe a third. Lots of Coke and such. I used to try to shoot 5 pgs a day. Action 3 pgs a day. Cost 35 grand avg in Philippines for a film India 45 grand Indy film maybe 200,000-400,000 grand. 100 US films get released in a year Indy and Studio.

The gaffer has a more immediate problem. If he wastes 5 minutes changing a bulb, he's wasted 5 mins times the number of people on the set standing around doing nothing times whatever hourly rate they are being paid.

Exactly.

Alle - I think you are taking my comments way out of context. And BTW.... ouch.

thanks, Mark Ratering!