Screenwriting : Are you afraid someone's going to steal your idea? by Phillip E. Hardy, "The Real Deal"

Laura Scheiner I used to think (and I even posted here) of it as a blueprint due to it's foundational nature in building a film around it. In the context of the A to Z of putting a film together, I guess that descriptor kinda still has merit, but as a stand alone comparison, I agree with what you said Laura. It is a story and storytelling and art and craft, but it also serves everything else associated with the production of the film. So I agree from an artistic standpoint that the comparison does it a disservice but I can also see how if you want to produce a film, it had better have a solid screenplay to refer to and build from.

Paranoia seems to run deepest in the freshly minted screenwriter flock. Some seem so fearful that they don't want anyone to read their writings and I find that a little counterintuitive when trying to sell a script. (I ain't gonna buy new shoes without trying them on first.) Sadly it's true that among the thousands of scripts floating around in the either, there truly are damn few ideas/screenplays worth stealing.

Your script is automatically copyrighted the moment you put words to paper - or any medium. Out-n-out plagiarism is a whole different matter and is very risky in the filmmaking industry.

Master thieves call it a “homage.” Don’t steal it exactly. Add your own spin on the same idea. “Fast N furious” and “Point Break” are the same except one uses cars than surfboards.

Steal from winners and add your own original spin. That will get you a job.

MaxXx: Every writer borrows or outright steals from writers who have influenced them. Just like musicians copy licks from other plays. I've learned a lot from other drummer and put my own spin on their shit. It's a good system.

Great earlier i did the mistake of sending my full screenplay and worried . now i can have some peace

I’m more afraid of nobody never reading my scripts...

LOL. Thanks, Pam!

I think it's as likely as getting hit by lighting. So no, I'm not afraid of this. On the other hand I would love for this to happen. Imagine that some idea you didn't do anything with is turned into a Blockbuster. Bragging rights for life right there.

You can't steal ideas because they are free for the taking.

I had a great idea for a movie... Then, five years later saw "Jumper" and thought, beggar, that's MY movie! LOL.

I agree to Dan Guardino and I wonder if you guys also find yourself working on an innovative idea and then, being one of the first to watch the latest movie in cinema, you are there just to figure out they had the same idea. In the beginning that frustrated me but today I can laugh about it as it shows we all are connected somehow and by this thought I feel I'm more in the creative flow than I thought.

You know when you are called in for a pitch meeting, the ideas out of your mouth are free. The other person with the checkbook pays for execution.

Jumper is based on a book though. From 1992. Also, I think the concept could warrant at least 5 more movies before we get tired of it. It's still very unique.

Erik Jacobsen You are IMHO correct.

Take Apple - They have literally stolen the ideas of MOST OF THEIR MOST SUCCESSFUL PRODUCTS. Blatantly. But they executed those ideas flawlessly.

http://www.bestmastersprograms.org/apple

...MUCH better than their competitors or even the original inventors could.

But to the point of the discussion...

If I'm in a Starbucks on Sunset&Holloway and I hear writers throwing ideas around, I wouldn't steal them- not because they aren't great ideas, but (as of yet) I haven't heard any idea I could properly execute on- although I;m sure many writers could. So it's not worth my effort. I've heard other successful writers say this - they are too busy with their OWN ideas. One of the cardinal rules is:

Write what you know.

I was outside Peets on Sunset in 2012 (I used to work at IAC) and heard guys talk about a vampire comedy where they all live together like they did in "friends". I thought it was cool but I could never write it. But then "What we do in the Shadows" was made. It may or may not have been the writers I was sitting next to, but I simply could not write that.

Getting a movie made - much less having it be successful is so rare, it's almost a statistically "fringe" event. About 700 movies make it to theaters every year but about 3000 are made each year. And about half actually make money (from a lot to maybe a dollar).

https://stephenfollows.com/hollywood-movies-make-a-profit/

How many screenplays are written each year?

Roughly 50,000 screenplays are registered with the WGA each year. Not including USPTO which is about the same or more.

100,000 screenplays a year. Let that sink in a moment. That about a 3% chance of your movie being made and a .007 (seven hundredths of one percent) of it being put in a theater. And HALF of that of actually making money.

BUT.... It does happen occasionally--

Famously Jeff Grosso, who paid his way through film school by playing Texas Hold ’Em, wrote a screenplay about it, then sued Miramax over its poker movie “Rounders.” And his lawyer says it happens a lot.

https://www.today.com/popculture/million-dollar-ideas-often-stolen-holly...

But... in the overall frontier of people writing out there, it's still pretty rare IMHO.

There is a difference between "stealing" an idea and stealing a story. No one steals ideas because they are basically nothing. But if you steal a full script or storyline then you can get sued.

Ya, hit the nail on da head bro. Dialog should sound real.

Jurij. You cannot be sued for stealing a story. Stories are a dime a dozen and they are not protected under the copyright treaty. The only thing that is protected are the writer's words, in other words their expression... how they tell their story. I wouldn't do it but stories are free for the taking some if someone takes your story they borrowed it they didn't steal it.

I guess if you do high concept about cravings for frozen cod fish sticks, you might worry but if you do common as dirt premises about people trying to survive in an insane world full of complexity, scarcity, human predators, and cynicism you shouldn't worry too much. You do have to worry about pitching non high concept scripts because apparently its all about dragging people into a theater to be disappointed. Big concept and bland story.

Dan, I want to say you are correct because it nearly never happens. People who are afraid of getting their story or idea stolen should rather worry about shark attacks. But there are some very, very few cases of a lawsuit based on storyline stealing. This is extremely uncommon so for all purposes it basically never happens. And you won't see much money from that either because stories and ideas are basically worth nothing. Often even worth a negative amount as you need money to get them on screen and they will end up for sure as duds on screen.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockout_(film)#Legal_action

nobody stole “Harry Potter” . JK Rowling was poor, typed her manuscripts and sent it by mail.

Jurij. There is no such thing as “story stealing” so nobody can sue someone for story stealing because stories are fee for the taking. I think you’re confusing “story stealing” with "copyright infringement" which someone could sue for but copyright only protects the author’s written words not the story. That is how the law reads. Most people aren't going to steal anything anyway because it is a lot cheaper to buy a screenplay than it is if they got sued.

Laura is right stuff happens. I had a producer once ask me to adapt a novel and make enough changes to it so he wouldn't have to pay for the rights to the book. There is no shortage of snakes in this business. However if you want to find a home for your screenplay or use it as a calling card you have to let people read it.

Laura. Same here.

If someone stole one of my ideas they would probably try to sue me for wasting their time.

Dan Guardino I'm not a lawyer, but I think even copyriight basically just gives a writer the right to sue. I don't think many writers out ther have the juice to go against Disney, Netfix, Fox, etc... Disney has hundreds Intellectual property firms that love to go after spec script writers... It's just too easy. Here's just fifty or so of them...

https://www.lawyers.com/intellectual-property/walt-disney-co/california/...

Kevin. A screenwriter can be named as a defendant in a lawsuit if someone accuses them of copyright infringement.

Writers are stealing ideas at pitches to buyers. It’s “Die Hard on a Bus”, “it’s Breaking Bad meets ET”, “it’s Ocean’s 11 but with 8 women.” Nobody seems to have any issues with that part of the trade.

“Copied?” That’s a gross misinterpretation of Picasso and Van Gogh...

Registering a claim of copyright is not required for copyright protections — you already have protections of “copyright” the very second you create a fixed work. Registering is voluntary. Says so right on the LOC website. However, should you ever wish to bring a lawsuit you do need a registered claim, which creates evidence with a third party that the claimed material was in your possession on such and such date. This is the general reason why most register a claim as common practice — just in case one should need stronger standing in court. Be prudent. But...to actually be able to have a solid case to sue you need much much more than a mere registered claim. It is far more complex than that. You have to prove direct access to the material, which is why many do not accept unsolicited material to protect themselves from false or fraudulent claims. You also have to prove word for word plagerism or direct copying of work. And this is where most cases fail. You cannot claim copyright of an idea, only of a specific execution.

It's well known Picasso, in his early life, copied Van Gogh. Picasso venerated Van Gogh. He framed the newspaper account of the infamous ear mutilation. To a lesser degree, Picasso emulated Degas, Toulouse-Lautrec and Gauguin. At some point Picasso diverged.

If you don't know art or art history than perhaps leave out false comparisons, false equivilancies and whataboutisms.

Yes, the ear-thing... an untruth still perpetulated.

Owen, I’m not going to launch into a long-winded explanation nor argue... I cannot clarify all the complexities and personal relationships between some of these artists on an online forum about screenwriting. Look to art scholars. Not generalized “knowns.” Many are false — The Mandela Effect. I have an art teacher in the family. I minored in art history myself and studied under a scholar and art historian.

LOL

Ah - Van Gogh... My favorite painter.

I'm not in any way an art historian or scholar.

Beth Fox Heisinger I went to two lectures from ppl that know a hell of a lot more than me at Musée d'Orsay - My recollection was there was controversy about whether Gauguin actually inflicted the wound -cos the next day he left Arles and they never saw each other again even though they were friends. Either way, the wound was horrific according to the doctor's accounts and it was apparently one wild night the two of them had.

...WAY OFF TOPIC... Friday discussion material.

Can you guys speak into my other ear. I don't hear so good out of the one side. ;)

(just trying to lighten the mood and transition the topic a bit.)

So...who's going to write the comedy about that night. I already envision it as a Renaissance version of "The Hangover". Gauguin and Van Gogh wake up and can't remember anything. Gauguin says something and Van Gogh can't hear and says so. Then they realize his ear is missing.

Hilarious mayhem ensues as they try to figure out what happened the night before, who cut off his ear and try to find it.

Okay, I’ll bite, sorry to momentarily hijack the thread... in a nutshell... influenced or inspired are better words. Gauguin was 33 years older than Picasso. Picasso was a child protege. He was interested in Gauguin’s philosophy on art. When he was working on pottery in Durrio’s studio he was surrounded by Gauguin’s work. Read his book Noa Noa. Gauguin inspired Picasso’s interest in Primitivism. Picasso and Matisse were friends and rivalries too. Many artists and writers of the time would hang out. Were friends or acquaintances. Exchanged ideas. Creatives inspire, influence, encourage, support and rival each other, do they not?

And about the ear lobe or injury, not the whole ear... evidence points to Van Gogh being attacked by Gauguin. They got into a fight outside a brothel as Gauguin wanted to leave him and leave Paris. It could have been an accident... Van Gogh made up the story about the prostitute to protect his friend, whom he was infatuated with —“a pact of silence.” There has always been question about this story. Plenty of documentation that proves the self-harm version is incorrect. A book by two German historians around 2009-ish (I think?) make the case. I was bummed to see it not included—yet again they perpetuated the same untruth—in the new incredible animated film about Van Gogh, Loving Vincent. The film is more a celebration of the artist’s work. The other thing... Van Gogh is always regarded as “mad.” He had epilepsy. They didn’t know what it was at the time. He also suffered from some form(s) of mental illness, but there’s really no means to a definitive diagnosis.

Sorry, Kevin, I’m on my phone and just saw your post... fixed some of my typos too. Lol! Yes, much controversy. Van Gogh is one of my favorites as well. Anyhoo, again sorry to hijack. It’s back to work for me. And hopefully a return to the thread topic. :)

One of my favorite movies; Loving Vincent.

I always thought he might have psychochromesthesia... Color causing physical sensations.

There is so much about medicine today that would have helped him.

The to-protect Gaugin fencing theory is a recent one and discredited by the Van Gogh museum in Amsterdam. The doctor's notes and illustrations of the wound from the time Van Gogh was brought in are online to peruse.

There's no denying Van Gogh's ear was injured (unless “Self-Portrait with Bandaged Ear and Pipe” is really “Self-Portrait with Earmuff and Pipe.”) as has been claimed. Prevailing academic wisdom is self-mutilation.

"Prevailing academic wisdom"—which academic? As I said, much controversy. Lol! The museum is protecting itself and its reputation. No one is disputing—there was an injury. The museum also prefers to focus on his work. Anyway, there is documentation—coorespondence between the two artists, with others. Plus different interpretations and speculations. The “official” version has holes. And Gauguin is not exactly a trustworthy person as far as his version of events... Again, the ear-thing has always been under a cloud of suspicion within many academic circles for years and years and years. Van Gogh’s “madness” questioned and challenged. The Gauguin fight gained more traction with more proof/plausibility.. Anyway, I'm done! I'm done! Promise! Should anyone be interested in the two German historian's book it’s titled "Pakt des Schweigens" - "Pact of Silence." :)

Getting back to the thread topic. No, I am not worried about theft. ;)