
Hey guys, it's Daniel here!
For those of you who don't know me, I'm an emerging writer & filmmaker from Italy, currently in the process of developing my first feature film.
A question to all the composers and filmmakers alike--
Based on your past and current working experiences, how do you establish the best working relationship with your composer? Or with your director, if you are a composer?
What are the principles upon which you can build a good, solid relationship? And how do you keep it flourishing throughout the entire collaborative process, so that it may one day become a durable partnership, and special and memorable things could come out of it?... Like those created by some of the most iconic parterships between directors & composers working at the highest level in the industry.
Thanks guys, work hard & be cool!!
Discuss in the lounges or research your favorite composer and read up on their likes and dislikes.
1 person likes this
For my current film, this was my first project with her. I went over the spotting process and explained while we probably won't sit down and have a formal session, she can provide me with guidance on the feel of each cue and it's context, where she wants music, where she didn't want music and any provided temp track or just tracks to listen are OK. She provided me with a short document and pointed to a specific track in the film "Tesla". I continued to struggle on what she wanted and the music style. She sent me an unlisted link to one of her previous films. I watched it and I was in awe by the script and acting. I was hooked for the whole film. I realized listening to the what there was of a score is that she preferred sparse cues with no melody, no acoustic instrumentation, and an 'artsy' feel. (I did though added one such instrument - a piano).
I will have scored half the film by today or tomorrow and will create a mockup for her to watch and listen to the score in context. I let her know that I am prepared to replace the score if it does not fit her style and work for her.
Not all my first time relationships are the same. In Sept. one of the two films I scored was with a first time relationship (I in Houston, she in LA). She provided me with some initial guidance especially for the opening scene and then trusted me with the total creation of the score and loved it when I was done.
My relationship, by the way, with filmmaker/directors I have worked before are often based on or similar to previous projects/collaborations. My second scored film in Sept. had half the cues specifically participated in by the director through a starting temp track and then even feedback on the type of instrumentation and percussion. I don't mind that since most of the time, the input matches what I was planning to do anyway
Interestingly, the two scores in Sept. were quite different in the collaboration but both scores were nominated for "Best Score" (i.e., I garnered 2 of 5 best scores) at the 168 festival next week. So the collaboration and working relationship is not as important as the final product as far as recognition imho.
Joel Irwin Thank you for your insight Joel!!
1 person likes this
Hi Daniel,
I'm a composer and have several ongoing collaborations with different directors. First of all, I would say that a good relationship is based on mutual respect and trust, respect for each others ideas. The director is the one with the vision and the composer is an important part of making that vision come true. To make it come true the director needs to be able to communicate this vision and the composer needs to dive into it, listen with both ears and understand that the composers role is to support the directors vision. In others words: the composer needs to understand that the film isn't being made to boost the composers ego (the composer must leave his/her ego at home). when the director doesn't care about the music it is a bad thing. The score can make or totally break the film so the wrong approach can destroy the entire in the worst case. In the best case the director cares about the music and listen to the composers suggstions and the director and composer share their ideas with eachother and are also willing to test them out. Communicating, sharing, respect, vision and common sense is a good start for a great Creative relationship. And most important: don't forget to have fun!
1 person likes this
Pontus Ullerstam Tidemand
Hey Pontus, thanks for your insight!!
"In other words: the composer needs to understand that the film isn't being made to boost the composers ego (the composer must leave his/her ego at home)."
I absolutely agree with your statement above- and I strongly believe it is often the source of many problems in the partnership between directors & composers (especially in the Indie world).
1 person likes this
Hi, I think I have written to you before on post on Facebook that you wrote about how to get a rememberable score? Nice to meet you here at Stage32!
Yes, it is definetly one of those things that causes trouble between a director and a composer. A humble approach from both sides is recommended. Both needs to trust each others judgement and knowledge, but the composer needs to understand and respect the directors vision. And don´t be afraid of testing each others ideas. It might work and it might not, but the composer needs to accept that it didn´t work. As with Hitchcock and Bernard Hermann: Hitchcock first hated the idea Hermann had for the shower scene, but it was an instant success. And when it came to Kubrick´s 2001 A Space Odyssey, he fired the composer Frankl Cordell because he realised that he wanted to use classical music by Strauss and other classic composers, and as we all know that choice was the correct thing to do and the film is considered to be one of the best films ever made. The process of scoring needs to be a conversation, and both the director and the composer needs to trust their guts, so it can be pretty much of a balance act. The bottom line is: both needs to communicate and listen, but in the end it is the directors vision and the story that should rule.
A good way to start communicating is to have a conversation about music. The director can send some examples of music that he/she likes, and vice versa. Best thing if they both can have a spotting session toghether, either physical or online and take notes. They can discuss the story in deatail and go in deeper into the scenes if possible. Using temp music can both be a good and a bad thing. It can give an idea of what director wants, but it can also make the composer and hinder the creativity and make him/her unsecure wether he/she should try to mimic the temp or make the score more personal and original. That is one of the reasons a lot of film scores aren´t very rememberable (as you can hear in most Marvel films the music is quite generic, simply because they have used a lot of temp music, and those ones you remember a probably the ones where the composer was encouraged to write more freely). a good example of balance is the original score for Star Wars. George Lucas first used the music from Holst´s The Planets and basically asked John Williams to use Holst´s music and rearrange it to fit the film. John William suggested instead that it would feel better if he could use Holst´s music as an inspiration. That lead to the now unforgetable Star Wars score.
So communicate and build up trust between each other.
2 people like this
Here is an example from 2019 that can happen sometimes - I was scoring a film about a man and his dog which was a comedy. The score matched that sense and in fact the film won it's competition for 'best comedy' at a festival. My main contact was the director. He specifically asked for the end title music to be 'super hero' genre. I tried to convince him that the music while end title still did not fit the genre and feeling of the rest of the film. He insisted and so I wrote super hero music. After the film released, even the producer told me the music didn't fit.
The point here is:
1. IMHO if I sign onto a film, I contribute and use my expertise but I still follow the instructions of my 'stakeholder'.
2. Like in any other company or business concern, I have a "boss" - in this case I took directions from the director. Except in very specific cases (which rarely happen in long distance score writing - me in TX and they in LA), I don't go over the head of my primary contact/stakeholder.
3. Some projects will not allow me total absolute freedom to do whatever I want. I am part of a team and those in charge have a 'vision' for the final product. My score is just a small part I may not always see/understand the difference between doing it 'my way' and doing it 'the stakeholder's way'.
4. My customer and the reason I score is my stakeholder (often the filmmaker or director). It is NOT the viewer or the listener of the film. The later's satisfaction and enjoyment is a BY PRODUCT. This is for me an important distinction. The closest analog I can think of is the seller of paints. I may think one particular shade of paint is exactly what the artist needs for a successful and impactful painting. I say 'this shade is exactly what the viewer wants'. But the viewer is not my customer, the artist decides. I can sell a particular shade (which I believe is the wrong shade) and make the artist perfectly happy and the painting could 'flop'. And yet I have done my job and have pleased my customers.