Screenwriting : Abduction by Adam James Mawson

Cut 58 pages. I think the major comps don't accept scripts over a certain page number or they charge extra $$$

Happy New Year, Adam! I'd cut 68. 90 pages is all you need for the American Market. If your script is 158 p, you don't have a grasp on structure yet. More homework on genre and structure is needed to help you build a shorter story. Hope this helps

Min .90 pag. -- Max. 115 pag.

What the others said Adam. Wayyyyy too long. It's hard enough to get execs to read scripts at all. If it looks like a lengthy read, chances are they won't even bother. Get it under 115 pages.

Thanks for your feedback folks but I was told the opposite a year ago. Also Close Encounters of the third kind is over 138 pages and Avatar was 152 pages long.

if you have a big name in the industry, it's "ok" to break the rules when it comes to length, Spielberg and Cameron falls into that category. Agree with previous others that it seems too long. Enter it into contests, to BlackList - there you'll get an idea of where you're at. Ask fellow writers to read for feedback and input. How many other screenplays have you written? Did you enter these into contests?

Scripts have gotten shorter over the years. Avatar was written by James Cameron, a legend who can pretty much do whatever he wants. 120 pages used to be the standard but execs I've talked to in the past few years say to keep it well under that mark, preferably under 110 pages. But hey, what does anyone here know, right?

My man... S32 is a platform for us to grow. Take what you like and discard the rest: I focus on getting in the industry with a script that fits the current spec market standards, and not being an exception to the rules. This journey is tough enough. Only trying to help, my friend.

I went to your profile to check out some pages for you. Nothing there. Post one page - I'll tell you where you're at - S32 is here for you, bro!

Hi Adam. ...Yeah, you need to cut pages. Perhaps view more recently written scripts from a variety of different writers to compare. Many screenwriting competitions have page number guidelines/restrictions for what they will accept. ;)

Hi Beth I have and some are from 135 to 170 plus. I year ago I had 70 pages done and I came onto Stage 32 asking for advice and people said you would be better with over 120 pages. Now I get the opposite it could be a T.V. Series or film. I think you get to the point when you just go with your heart and believe in yourself. I know Stage 32 is a great and powerful tool which is here to help but they seems to be too many different ideas which can be confusing when you're trying to break into the industry.

I wish you the best, but for your own sake - look up ongoing contests; they will give you what is the industry standard for feature scripts. Unless you have been optioned/produced, winning or scoring high in competition will make it easier to get to managers and agents. Don't give up, but don't shoot the messengers either.

Thank you Heidi I will and thank you for answering my original question I asked. Others just telling me how many pages it should be.

@Adam because a page count like that is going to add to the already difficult task of finding an agent. How many scripts have you written and what draft are you on with this script? Have you gotten feedback from any execs as of yet? Contests? Anything? No one is saying longer scripts don't exist. They are saying that as an unproven screenwriter, you are going to have an even more difficult time than usual with a script that long. Industry standard is 90-120 pages, which I'm guessing is what you were told last year when you came here with a 70 page script. Maybe post your script on your profile for feedback? That might be a good start to help you get where you want to be.

Adam, you are writing a spec script, yes? You wish to enter screenwriting competitions, right? This is your first script, I assume? And you would like to find industry representation, correct? This really isn't about "going with your heart," but rather typical page counts and general expectations for spec screenplays within the industry. As I said, many competitions have page count guidelines. For example, THE PAGE Screenwriting Competition 2017 rules and guidelines for all feature length screenplay entries: 80-120 pages. Plus at an entry level, trying to break into the industry as a screenwriter, you will encounter many others who will tell you the same thing—an agent or manager or exec or script consultant or contest judge will tell you to cut pages. They just will. The (unfair) immediate assumption about your 158 page script is that it is overwritten. The hard truth: some won't even crack it open. They have hundreds, if not thousands of scripts to read. And most of those are around 100 pages. Now you may dismiss what many of us are telling you, which is your choice. But perhaps after you have gained more experience and had more encounters with the industry yourself you may begin to see the forest for the trees. I wish you the best with your writing! Good luck! :)

Hi Adam I have the original Black List script of PASSENGERS (written in 2007-8 and it's 125 pages). It's not a spec script but it is a good read & analyse of what "Industry agents" want. DM me if you want to read it. Beth is correct. Most Readers (the first people you gotta win over) won't read anything over 125pges. I used to read professionally for a prod company. Anything over 120pages, I would simply shove back into the pile.

Dan MaxXx : I'd love to read it. I personally like Jon Spaiths writing, and have been looking for this script for a while. hshendrickson@gmail.com

Heidi- sure. and paypal $1000000000 :)

I can get the screenplay down to 125 pages without losing any major plot then I will enter it into screenwriting competitions thanks again guys.

Lower!

Adam if you can cut it down to 125 do it and then take out every word that doesn't need to be in it then to be there. Here are a few tips for doing that. Don’t describe every detail in the scene. Avoid describing character’s every movement. In other words paint your scenes with broad strokes and let the reader’s imagination fill in the rest. Avoid words that can usually be eliminated such as “are”, “and”, “there”, “it is”, “it's”, “to go”, “to say”, “is”, “to be” and words ending in “ly” and “ing.” You can usually eliminate first words of dialogue such as "Well", "No", "Yes", "Of course", "I mean", etc. Eliminate words like "hello", "goodbye", "please", "thank you", and "you're welcome" unless used for irony or emphasis. Avoid having your character ask questions but when they do don’t have the other character answer if the audience will assume what the answer would be. Replace the "to be" verbs with an active verb or eliminate them entirely. For example "She is in uniform" becomes "In uniform.” "It is dark outside" becomes “Dark, " etc. Make all your action immediate. Eliminate words like "suddenly", "then", "begins to", "starts to" and just make the action happen without any sort of temporal qualifier. For example: "Suddenly, he runs off." becomes "He runs off." "She starts to climb" becomes "She climbs." Hope this helps get your page count down where it probably needs to be.

Thanks Dan that really helps.

Very nice post, Dan.

Dan FTW.

Thanks again, Dan G, for sharing those great tips on how to write more tersely, pithy. Very helpful. :)

When I am doing a "thinning of the herd" pass. I make a note of what every scene is trying to achieve plot and character subtext. If I have done it in a previous scene I can dump one of them. John August was a reader and he said long scripts are read, because people are paid to read. They'll never get passed the read, but they will be read.

Great thread. THE SCREENWRITERS BIBLE is a solid resource on current industry spec standards.

Hi Adam, Hope you enjoy the site and make lots of useful contacts. A lot of the competitions for features have a limit of 120 pages. So you might have to trim some scenes or perhaps another option is to adapt it for TV. With some work, could the first 50 pages be used for a pilot? Anyhow I hope you have success with whatever you do.

Please, Adam, listen to these people. they aren't here to set you back, only to help. I had a consult with an Austin Flim Judge, she told me to not go over 90 pages, that way if it got picked up it gave them an extra ten pages to play around with to make their changes.

Adam: Welcome so S32 and congratulations on completing your screenplay.. You've received good counsel from several folks I respect. I've written 28 scripts and have exceeded the 120 page limit on only three screenplays. But for most features, 90 to 120 pages is where you should be. I use the term non-value added for any scenes, narrative or dialogue that is not essential to the script. If the material doesn't move the story along then you should consider trimming it. Its good to read the script through using the Final Draft Speech Control tool. Always seek to trim your dialogue and any unnecessary words. Often during the dialogue, character will address another character by name in too many lines. I never do that and when I read it in other scripts I find it annoying.

CJ Thank you for that I feel I have something unique and I can possibly lose a few pages but I don't want to lose too much. I made a short film for Abduction to send with my screenplay which I'm not sure anyone else has done before. I thought it would help to give my vision of what it could look like before they read the screenplay. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ecX9eHs1-58&t=10s

Great post @CJ. This is how I want to see writers--- radical, adventurous, trend setters. But, in this present market, you have to be realistic and practical. As many great minds have pointed out, Adam still has a lot to prove. He needs to go with the norms, to avoid being passed. He is done with his work and had asked for an agent. I think its smart to abide by the rules. Or if he wants a production team to get the movie out, that is another angle. Adam might just be that artist that can defy trends.

HI CJ I've read Adventures in the Screen Trade by William Goldman which I thought helped massively. This is also my first screenplay which I have rewritten numerous times to make it something to be proud of.

Adam, congrats!

Sorry I have to disagree with my esteemed colleague CJ. I will preface my remarks by saying anyone familiar with me knows I march to my own drummer. My JD Salinger biopic script The Man Who Bore The Myth is competing for best screenplay at Chandler Film Festival this month and is currently 132 pages, not including cover page. This script has been a multi-festival finalist, including Austin Film Festival and Beverly Hills Screenplay contest. It is a weighty, adventurous effort but I believe in the material and what I did with the length of it. Those who are interested can read the script, which is exclusively posted at Script Revolution (NOT A PLUG!). I have also exceeded the sacred 120 page limit for my Western The Bloody Benders and a couple of other weightier screenplays. But I’ve done nothing past 134 pages. That being said, I have a fair amount of experience with contests, festivals and producers. I can assure you that if you submit material that violates what is most certainly an industry standard, whether unwritten or cast in concrete, you are going to be a salmon swimming up Niagara Falls. You may get to the top but you'll meet considerable resistance along the way. When it comes to accepted practices even as minor as title font, I've stopped doing what I used to do, which was doing larger titles with what I thought was cool fonts. And I've seen many well-known screenplays that do have special logo fonts. But they're also movies that have been made. But I've had a few readers get so hung up on that they subsequently trashed my scripts. And I mention this merely as an illustration that you can easily sabotage your efforts to get your material read by industry people. Because violating accepted practices are to many readers, the earmark of an amateur. Finally, I am willing to violate accepted industry standards or for that matter inferred ones for the sake of artistic integrity and satisfaction. But I do so fully aware that it may cause a reader to hit the delete button on my script or if it's a hard copy, toss it in their reject pile.

CJ: is one smart hombre and why we Yanks should consider the United Kingdom one of our greatest allies. I highly recommend that you use his wonderful new and free service the Script Revolution. That is a plug!

Andrew: Great point. If you're posting is any reflection on your screenplay writing, I'm sure you're doing a good job.

reality check. Nobody in the Industry will read a 158-pg spec script especially if you are an unknown or have 0 money. You failed out of the gate. A professional Reader will turn to the last page first, see 158 pages, write a PASS coverage. "AMATEUR." It's not personal. It's business.

Reality ^^^

That's what's up, A.S.... I asked for page one much earlier in the thread. I believe we're talking way above pay grade. We're talking 158 pages when chances are there's not one well-written page. Nothing personal. This is show business.

Adam. Dan M is right what he said a lot of readers will do. Also Hollywood goes by the old one page equals one minute of film time so some producers will figure it might be too expensive for them to produce. Keep in mind a lot of people in the business aren't the brightest people around. I don't know how many screenplays you have under your belt but if you only have a few I would definitely try to get the page count under 110. That is the cut off for a lot of the smaller production companies and 105 is probably the number you should shoot for. I made one suggestion on how to write economically but you also might what to try and start each scene as late as possible and end the scene as early as you can. Also try to avoid question and answer type dialogue because they take up twice the space as if a character just comes out and same thing without the back and forth dialogue. If you want to send me a few pages I might be able to show you where you might cut pages without hurting the story. I have adapted about 12 novels so I am pretty good at condensing stories so they work on film. Either way I wish you luck with your project.

What if... Just what if Adam is the next Robert Bolt? Lawrence of Arabia was 143 pages and Adam is only exceeding that of 15 pages. Let's be open minded.

It's seems there are people on here that aren't too fond of first time screenplay writers. Some great feedback on here and I appreciate you guys taking the time to do so. I won't be uploading it on here as to say that not one page won't be written well is a ridiculous statement to make. Time will tell if I've made it this far and also I have had a lot of interest from certain producers who loved the idea of the short film I made to show my vision to back up the screenplay was genius for learning how to use the visual effects software plus Final Cut Pro HD and filming all scenes with an iPhone. But who am I to say anything it's my first screenplay.

That's what's up, Adam. I wasn't trying to be rude. This is a goods and services business. And I was merely trying to see the goods. That's all. Just remember we're here to help you grow. That's what we do. We also know from doing this for years, no one is more arrogant than a rookie - myself included. We have no idea what we don't know. Stage32 is here to help us think on a higher level in this emotion delivery business we call, Hollywood. Feel free to contact me if there''s anything I can do to help you in your journey. I also have pages posted as a current spec market sample. Hope this helps. Always here for you, my friend. .

I didn't read it that way at all, Adam! Think there is some really solid and helpful advice within. This platform was built on the foundation of collaboration and inclusion, no matter whether you're on your 1st script or your 25th. Wishing you all the best on your journey, my friend.

I'd also like to add, I am open minded, nice, and all that. Nicest guy you'll ever meet. I'm just direct :)

Adam: I ditto what RB said. Advice flows here like a raging river and some of it is very direct, and occasionally flat out crap. But more often than not, there are many happy to assist.

I'll testify, Shawn Speakes the truth!

LOL! No worries I know your here to help I guess we can all get defensive when alot of people that you don't know can be so direct. Don't get me wrong I'm the most honest and upfront person you will ever meet. Which doesn't do me any favours with the In-Laws lol.

My man! The most important thing is we''re in the right place, doing the right thing: discussing craft.

...and whenever you feel like you're ready to share a few pages for guidance on what to do next, I'm here for you. I'm not perfect and I'm 'not there' - but I'll pass along what I can to help you grow. I'm at: theshawnspeake@gmail. I'll gladly provide very 'basic' coverage on the house. Strictly confidential. That's what we do. Stage32 is here for you

Adam I mean this in the best way, but if people telling you to cut your page count down puts you on the defense, you are gonna have a heck of a time the first time you get real criticism. You have to have a really thick skin in this industry. It's a cold world out there, friend.

I've managed to lose 20 pages so far and I'm 2 thirds of the way through.

Cheers Dan when you take a break then go back you notice there's is alot that can be taken out without losing any of the plot. My problem was that i kept going into too much detail of then scenes thinking that might help the director visually.

Finally I've finished my screenplay with only 124 pages from 158 pages. It took some doing but it's done thanks for all your help guys.

Adam: Well done and smart move. Most of us have gone through the same thing on earlier work.

It was torture but flows a lot better now I need a producer to read this SOB!