Screenwriting : A few helpful writing tips to keep in mind... by Paul Zeidman

Wut doo yu meen? ;)

That must be a grueling task. But this is where the good ones shine, eh?

Paul, thanks so much for posting this!!

Pretty much most scripts I read I'll tell the writer the same thing. There are so many writers who believe that is not important. I don't get it.

Especially with my feature-length scripts, it feels like no matter how many times I read it there's always some type of Error. Spelling. Grammar. Format. Mentally, I get exhausted after a while.

So true Eric C. Jackson Plus, I can reread my work, but since it came from my fat head, I am not necessarily reading it but reciting it, therefore missing some stupid mistake. Luckily my readers catch that stuff (usually). Paul Zeidman Is even one dumb typo forgivable? How many errors like that would it take for you to want to throw the thing in the fire and punch the writer in the face?

One or two in the whole script is okay. I once read one that had a typo in the second line on the first page, then 3 more in the next 5 pages. If you don't take this seriously, nobody will take YOU seriously.

Eric - ask a writer you trust to proof it, or spend the $ for a professional. A fresh pair of eyes always sees things we don't.

Unless one has a learning disability, spelling, grammar, typo type errors = You're just not trying hard enough.

With due respect, Paul, this is bullshit. Certainly, typos et al are to be avoided. However, it seems a script with 4 typos in the first 5 or 6 pages was immediately discounted. What about the story? That's the focus. Harping on this relatively minor issue lets the reader off the hook to analyze the story effectiveness. Why do that when typos can be flagged.

I read for several fests and one script by an ESL writer had grammatical errors but was totally understandable. The story was amazing. It went on to win the grand prize. What if it was shut out because there were errors? Usage is easily fixable. Crafting an effective story is difficult.

Some real advice about your script: don't describe a movie, tell a story.

Avoid usage errors. Get proofed. But above all, pray you get a competition reader with a modicum of tolerance and understanding about what the contest means - finding great stories. No wonder writers don't take comp readers seriously.

Sorry, Tony, but based on how you treated me in our previous interaction, I simply can't give any value to anything you say.

Ditto. Coverage that begins with "I didn't like the story" prejudges and lacks any semblance of fairness. The question of likeability is irrelevant. (I don't like Westerns but read them with a neutral eye.) And following with a mean-spirited hatchet job bereft of anything useful - tossed after a few lines - is indicative. This method has been seen before.

Kill the messenger, if that's the desire. I'll leave others to determine inner meaning.

Many comps have a grid including Craft. Mark it low or lower for a few typos. Placing the entire emphasis on it is a mistake.

second that, so important!

As someone who's broken in despite having real issues with spelling and grammar and someone close to numerous dyslexics working in the industry, I can tell you that your advice is well intentioned but the generalisations, along with some of your comments, are woefully inaccurate.

You are in no position to say screenwriters can only make 1-2 errors per script and certainly not speaking for the industry when you say nobody will take a writer seriously over these issues.

Sorry to be curt but these kind of comments are bordering on damaging. I put myself through hell over this topic because I took what people said on screenwriting forums to heart.

The industry is incredibly forgiving and wants creative talent above all else. I've had my work read by the former heads of major studios, real tough people, and, I can assure you, nobody has said, "It's a great script but I got to the third typo and lost all respect for the writer.".

This type of superficial obsessing is for the competition world and one of the reasons it regularly fails to deliver any tangible results to either competitors or industry members.

I'm glad we're discussing this because yes, CJ Walley there is a lot of intimidating misinformation out there about this topic. Even though I'm a person who properly formats her texts (my teens make vigilant fun of me) and cringe at the misuse of there/their and to/too (I'll claw my eyes out), I am terrified that some oversight will discount my story (and yes, guilty of the misuse of to/too as well). But we all make mistakes and you're absolutely correct that there has to be some level of forgiveness in that. Obvi,, it's our job to polish the best we can which is why Paul Zeidman 's advice is good. But as long as the story is coherent, concise and well developed then it will shine no matter what! Sidenote: I stopped paying money for contests because I didn't find they were worth it. There's far more filmmakers out there to get your film made than contest winners. And I write rom coms and Hallmark style films - generally, not the ones picked for contests.

to defend Paul's statement, as someone who's had to dig into the slush pile myself, there's a difference between errors here and there and errors that make it harder for you to understand what they're actually trying to say.

I've seen stories so plagued with errors that I couldn't hardly get into it. I've seen people ignore the guidelines that were set for them to the point where it hurts their story.

So yes, you're going to have errors, but double check to see if you can get the worst of them. Find someone you trust to help you edit if you don't trust yourself.

I had one competition that sent feedback and the only bad check I got was on grammar. Problem with that was there was ONE error and it was missing a possessive hyphenation. That's overkill on perfection in my opinion. Sheesh

There's also monumental difference between reminding people to proof read their work and telling people specifically how many typos they can get away with or stating nobody will take you seriously if you make a set number of mistakes.

That's all I'm pointing out and why I said Paul's advice was initially well intentioned. It's the further comments which I feel go way too far.

Of course we should all do our best and never get lazy. That much is obvious and spans into countless areas far more critical than typing and proofreading skills.

Isn't judging the distance of comments the same thing.

I pitched to an exec. on this site and the only thing he commented on was my Grammar. I only had a few errors. I would have liked to received feedback on the story itself. I felt like I was back in elementary school. Any other comments he made were vague and useless. Oh well.

I experienced exactly the same thing, 40% on tech issues, barely anything on story. Wonder if it was the same exec. They dunned the script for NOT having scene numbers - a definite no-no in Specs - and seemed totally confused by the use of sub slugs and called them wrong. Then had several serious grammatical issues in the coverage. Who are these people?!

CJ Walley great point! After being told, great animation for Disney, well-developed, strong character and love the concept but an error like "that" will cause execs to not take you seriously, freaking crushed my spirit for a moment. However, I now proofread the hell out of a script before I send it. I'm not letting execs off the hook. Receiving feedback with misspelled words is unacceptable. Moral of the story, no one is perfect and ALL great stories will be told one way or another. Happy writing!

One of my past-times is reading produced movie scripts like Men in Black, etc.. I find grammar errors all the time in them.

I'm pretty obsessive about my grammar in my scripts, but every single time I re-read them, I find more mistakes. An interesting feedback comment I once received was; "You're an excellent writer, but this story needs further development." So although it had very few errors, a good story it did not make! :)

The story is the most important part, but take your typos seriously.

Yes, in conclusion ALL the comments can be true at the same time ;)

Thanks, Z! ☮️

Ok well here's a question, what about using the correct verb? I find it challenging to describe movements or reactions. Where do those fall in the judging/reading process?

In separating one's script from another it's not a matter of word choice. If the act of sitting is portrayed, does plops, drops or one of forty other words serve better? Perhaps. The real difference is Voice. An average script describes actions rather than adding emotional cement, and interest, to the story.

CJ - I tend to disregard all advice found on forums

Extending to OPs as well.

Most Readers and Producers know how to read a screenplay from audience perspective and will not pass on a script because of a few formatting, grammar and spelling errors. However they can be distracting. If you are writing spec screenplays you want to them to be written as well as humanly possible to show people in the industry that you know the business and how to write for it. personally I do use an editor to help me do a final edit because I do tend to make spelling and grammar mistakes.

Dan Guardino I agree. I am a reader for playwrights and I don't pass on plays because of minor formatting, etc. I look for a great story and story structure. As you stated, I read from an audience perspective. The audience isn't watching words, misspelled words, and grammatical errors. They're enjoying the skills of directors, writers, costume designers and actors. And if they laugh, sigh or cry the storytellers have done an amazing job at making a connection and telling a "story." I guess I'm just not petty and love to give creators opportunities at all levels. In my opinion that's how we grow.

in television, that's what Writer's Assistant/Script Coordinators must do - they proof, fix formatting errors before making script copies and distributing to cast & crew. Also helps to master Final Draft/or whatever software the staff is using.

Most of us aren’t on writing staffs. Most of us don’t have reps. Most of us query reps to get our work noticed which, we hope, leads to bigger and better things.

So instead of discussing what the industry should or shouldn’t do, put yourself in the shoes of a Manager.

A Manager has 48 hours of script reading crammed into a 24 hour day. He’s got to make decisions. Like triage. Those with the best writing samples get the most attention and the longest reads.

So if your script has grammatical or spelling or formatting errors, he’s going to assume (remember, you’re in his shoes) that the writer doesn’t care enough to actually spend the time to do things right. And if the writer doesn’t want to spend the time, why should the Manager?

In addition, let’s say the Manager is really into your script. He’s transported to the world of your story. He’s getting more involved when – spelling error.

Damn. Takes him right out of the story.

Why would you want to do that? Or do you think Managers should be more forgiving? Good luck in stumping for that.

So, yeah. Grammatical, spelling and formatting errors can be a big obstacle in getting both you and your script taken seriously.

How many errors?

I don’t know. But if I guess five per script and the Manager reading my script allows less than that, well, then I’m just shit outta luck.

That’s why I try to make my script the best it can be.

Any number of things could be projected. A manager could be transported, not give a crap about a misspelling and keep reading.

Tony, you're absolutely right. But which managers are you referring to? Because if you don't know which managers allow what, then it becomes nothing more than a crap-shoot. So wouldn't it make more sense for a writer to take care of his/her business before sending out the script?

I totally agree with anyone above who says story is key and I would add to that, characters that jump off the page are equally important but I get the point Paul was trying to make. Checking grammar and spelling is not rocket science, although obviously someone doing an international translation has a harder task. Everyone makes mistakes, especially when working long hours but there is a vast difference between occasional slip up and blatant disregard. This is a tough industry with few places for success and readers may feel they are disrespected by errors that could have been easily avoided. A script and first reader is a blind date, judges don't expect perfect but mistakes again and again test the intellect of the reader. Why has this writer not prepared themselves for this select time with me? There is no cost to checking these errors and even free apps to help with their writing process? I think the situation is a bit like someone turning up on a date who has not even bothered to look their best when it costs nothing to do so. Paul is right to warn about the spell check cos I once did not realise I was on a computer with automatic spell check and it ruined a lot of the words I had actually spelled correctly. I only just caught this one hour before submitting to reader. KEEP ON WRITING EVERYONE and stay safe!

Tom Batha We sent a script to super manager Adam Kolbrenner. He commented on our typos :)

Which are you, Dash?

Seems kind of wild that we can't actually rely on all those programs to find blips. I like the posts that say a blip or two is not the end of anything. Phew! Relief!

All well and good. What about incorrect English usage that passes spellcheck? Where the homophone waste is used for waist or vice versa? The confusion over your and you're, or their, there and they're. Lies and lays. Who and whom. Attorneys General? Passers-by? FD spell check won't catch all too common errors because they're spelled correctly, and neither will the writer or else they wouldn't have written it that way.

In general, comma usage is atrocious. Forget advanced nuance like parallelism if basics are not followed. Further, it's not surprising some industry pros and readers may not know either - so that's good news for writers.

Writers should always get another pair of eyeballs on their scripts, learn proper English usage, hire a proofer. (A good proofing will teach English to the writer.) Grammarly was mentioned. That could be a resource. The alternative is hanging on poorly written, self-aggrandizing, apocryphal tales about what a manager said. Of course it's sexier text, but how does it serve writers in the trenches who seek excellence? It also smacks of fearmongering.

Writers, take heart. If English errors, a few misspells, are flagged as a major issue, the feedback is suspect. This doesn't let anyone off the hook to do their best in writing properly. What still truly matters is a damn compelling story.

Always strive to show a compelling tale written in an industry recognized format with the minium errors. It's a hard task for sure and a few glitches along the way ought to matter not - just don't get sloppy. Try your best - readers appreciate it.

When I finish a screenplay I export it to Word to check grammar and spelling. Then I send it to my editor. Then I do one more edit and find more mistakes. I don't know if I ever read a screenplay that didn't have any mistakes. All you can do is the best you can. Half the producers out there probably wouldn't even notice a few misspelled words because they aren't exactly the best spellers either.

Seems the consensus in this thread is to try our best, strive to improve, but not obsess. That seems very reasonable and balanced to me.

The important thing is everyone is getting their work out there and not hiding it away. There’s a lot of fear mongering out there.