Screenwriting : What is the reason for the collapse of superhero movies? by Arthur Charpentier

Personally, I think they made too many of them.

Jerry Robbins, I agree with you, they made too many films about female superheroes who did not develop as individuals, but only promoted feminism. And they hoped to sell it to a male audience.

Intriguing take, Arthur Charpentier. There might be something to it, though I personally stopped watching all the superhero movies awhile back because, like Jerry Robbins, stated, there are too many of them, and to extend that sentiment, they're all the same plot-wise.

I think they've made too many of them as well.

Arthur Charpentier - I think that what you're suggesting is accurate and that most audiences may not realize it yet and attribute it to superhero fatigue. We've never had drama fatigue or scifi fatigue. I know there's a lot of love for Marvel movies but they have followed a cookie-cutter approach to their movies and that in itself may be what audiences are tiring of. I think we can have a superhero movie but only if the hero grows into something they were not in the beginning of the movie.

Too many of them and not enough Kryptonite.

Somewhat Ironically, I think Marvel became the Thanatos of superheroes in movies.

They are falling into a formula. This makes them predictable and boring. People like to be made to think and experience something new. When a story is predictable you are not experiencing something new as you know what is happening, you are experiencing it in your head before it happens, so when it happens, it cannot feel new.

Name me a super hero that has died? Ironman. Which was the last great superhero? Ironman.

Suicide Squad could have been great, but the villain sucked. It became a video game, very episodic.

Who said Superhero movies collapse? For me I dont watch many now because Im old(er). I followed Marvel movies since Iron Man 1.That was 20-years ago. All my Superhero actors I pay money to watch are over 50-years old.

Maybe the bosses in charge target younger audiences. Dunno. Please let us know what goes on inside corporate movie making, planning a series of superhero movies for next 10/15 years.

Craig D Griffiths I must agree with you.

not enough depth and light as a feather. I always come back to James Gunn's last Guardians film, so much depth and despair but still hope. old saying goes there's gotta be dark for there to be light.

Craig D Griffiths, Ironically, the multiverse promised a variety of enemies and adventures, but instead we got Marvels and the Hulk Woman.

When people say that there are too many superheroes, in fact it means that they do not appreciate them, do not respect them. This means that viewers do not consider superheroes to be personalities. because they don't see their personal growth. Modern superheroes have lost the respect of the audience.

All male superheroes have turned into idiots, and female superheroes have turned into stupid arrogant feminists.

Batman, Iron Man, Captain America, commanded the respect of the audience by the strength of their character, despite their shortcomings.

Dan MaxXx, I still haven't seen the movie Iron Man 1. But I liked the following films of the franchise.

Kevin Felix, Unfortunately, in Guardians of the Galaxy 3, the main character was also made a fool, which causes less respect than before. I think if the film had a different director, it would have failed at the box office, because the script differs little from other studio films this year.

Leonardo Ramirez, The pattern is that at the beginning of the film, the character of the hero is severely degraded. and then it is raised to a normal level. thus, the studio shows the artificial growth of the character of the hero.

Ty Strange, The fantasy, action, and horror genres also have one plot, but no one claims that there are too many films. This is just an excuse to hide the obvious - changes in films do not work, viewers are not interested in stories about strong independent racially and gender diverse women in films with a bad script. And the scenarios are bad because the characters do not grow as individuals, but replace the strength of character with propaganda.

I think there will always be a place for the super hero movie. But fresh characters matter to a degree, at least adapting new characters. It's like an old Xerox machine - if you keep making new copies of the old ones they fade. But Venom or Ant Man before they happened were fresh.

Sam Sokolow, I agree with you, but I think the problem is that in movie comics, the image of a superhero is important, his coolness. however, it is difficult to come up with a cool new super hero, and the risk of failure is high, given the high budgets of the films.

It seems to me that stories about anti heroes suffer less from failure than stories about good superheroes.

I tune out whenever they launch into those epic battles of physics-defying mayhem which you know are all done on green-screen. Ironically, the more epic it is, the more boring it becomes....

Greg Harvey, I think battles are not interesting because they are not a reflection of the inner struggle of a superhero, but are used as another checkmark of virtue.

They sacrificed characters and story for big FX and pointless sequels. I walked away from them along time ago.

Did superhero movies become popular as undeniable argument why it is worthy to go to cinema theatres? You can't get such satisfaction of action and special effects home.

I don't think it's fair to blame the stories when it's really the genre that's suffering from overexposure. Plus, those classic tales (in terms of message) can be told over and over to generation after generation of movie goer.

Surely the focus for every screenwriter should be on what the next thing is likely going to be in the eyes of producers looking for material.

When I first started writing, it was zombie and vampire movies that were all the rage. I don't know anyone peddling that stuff now - or looking for it.

I'm simply tired of them, Arthur. But I wouldn't call it a collapse because H-wood cycles like everything else in the entertainment industry. I like the swing away from comic book heroes toward other sci-fi with socially impactful messages/themes/topics and we could use a long run of Notting Hills just to inspire happiness. There's enough dread in the world right now.

I want to draw your attention to the fact that the struggle of a superhero with an antagonist is not the main narrative. Because a superhero is always ready and has all the resources to overcome such obstacles.

The main thing in the plot is the desire of the superhero to live a normal ordinary life. Only a normal life can put an insurmountable obstacle in front of a superhero, which he will be able to overcome as a result of the personal growth of his character.

Only Spider-Man tells a similar story. The rest of the films are typical action films about a fight between good guys and bad guys. This is not a superhero movie! That's why I'm writing about the collapse of superhero movies, because studios stopped making them. There are almost none. They replaced superheroes with action films about the work of super special services.

Its becoming more and more cmmon for reviewers to cite "superhero fatigue" in audiences, so it could simply be that audiences want something else.

Many combinations with different genres to have so many interesting Superheroes projects. If you can make a project with not the hugest budget you need to beat at least few times to not downgrage the whole sub-genre it's an amazingly bright future to have enrichen streaming service content. What would any network do without any superhero projects?

Two words: FAT. TEEG. My love affair with Marvel ended after 2013's IRON MAN 3 and I never looked back. Boredom set in as each new release just morphed into different titles and hero costumes wrapped in the same bland Good V Evil story.

I think that the creativity died with Stan Lee when it comes to the Marvel Studios... What they need is fresh blood. Arthur Charpentier Bill Brock Miroslavas Siniavskis Ewan Dunbar Matthew Kelcourse CJ Walley Bill Albert GJ Harvey Sam Sokolow Kevin Felix

Miroslavas Siniavskis, Sitcoms and detective stories are more popular than the superhero genre.

Seen deleted scenes? Wonder if marketing Depts have final cut of Superhero Movies, and how many different plots can be assembled in post-production.

https://x.com/historyofthemcu/status/1737178352220250390?s=46&t=QE6_iR24...

Mark Deuce maybe they need me then? I have written 7 long form scripts over last 4 years with the ability to draft up about 12 projects per year. Superhero movie is my main genre so far because as Lithuanian I love to dream Hollywood which is a magical place to me since childhood. Also no one is done it before from my country.

I am proud to brag that I was able to get signed by WGA agency although my English is mediocre my stories still needs a professional edits.

Logline ideas are in my profile. I am passionate to imagine the possibility to have available superheroes program to integrate them in normal lifes. That is possible only when taking away their superpowers. Making it a life drama series can be very interesting.

Then I have bad superheroes prison with same concept of taking away superpowers for everyone who are caught. The drama lies in inability to do it perfectly: whether for escape possibilities or making bad superheroes more mad.

Arthur, that's fine. Still it will be much more boring with not having anything from this genre.

Miroslavas Siniavskis, I only watch the TV series Boys and the Peacemaker.

Mark Deuce, I agree, the great Stan Lee led the Marvel Studio to success. He was the best at understanding superheroes.

Dan MaxXx, It would be interesting to know. although they definitely shoot several endings.

Bill Brock, I watched almost everything before the endgame. I was not satisfied that the personal growth of the heroes of Marvel films was mainly at the teenage level. because of this, the stories lacked psychological depth.

Matthew Kelcourse, The modern world is much safer and friendlier than in ancient times. All sorts of horrors are an illusion created by the media. you just need to turn off the news and not watch them in order to see the kindness of the world around you.

CJ Walley, there is nothing difficult to show the life of a superhero in ordinary conditions among ordinary people and his attempts to cope with our daily difficulties. There is no need to show a war every time with a flat template supervillain who once again wants to enslave the whole world.

The same old sausage from the same old grinder.

That and greed.

Many have expressed the opinion that superhero movies have become formulaic. I do not agree with the conclusion that the pattern is visible due to the large number of films and TV series. The pattern arises from the fact that screenwriters pay little attention to the psychology of the hero.

And this is because the authors do not understand the essence of the superhero, its purpose in the plot. A superhero does not exist to protect the world and defeat supervillains.

The character of the superhero is an idealist. But it is very difficult for idealists to live in our real world. This is his main weakness and disadvantage. Superman's kryptonite is a lie, an absolute lie. Being perfectly honest, superman does not understand lies, does not know how to recognize and avoid them.

Moreover, perfect honesty makes superman socially awkward in our hypocritical world. This is what comic situations should be based on. Being physically invulnerable and completely honest, he does not know very well when to hide the truth in communication with other people.

It seems to me that this element was missing in Snyder's films.

Well, Arthur, maybe you should screenshot this entire post and email to ppl in charge of making superhero movies- let them know you know what's wrong. Maybe they will hire you.

You asked a question and then recorrected everyone's comment.

While we're at it, in the new year let's have greater skepticism of nihilistic members who spin wild claims about phony successes and post specious advice.

Well...then they'd have to close down the comment section for lack of participants.

Not at all. Just call bullshit on those who obviously spew it. There used to be three but now there are only two barnacles still attached to the hull of the SS Stage 32. Help scrape them off.

Dan MaxXx BAM! Once again, NAILED IT, DAN! Dammit, man! Reading your posts is well-worth the monthly $39 admission price. Keep 'em coming! : )

Dan MaxXx, I definitely won't do this, if only because I'm interested in the genre of science fiction and cyberpunk. But I don't mind discussing on the site the reasons for the failures of superhero films. My plans do not include teaching anyone, I expressed an opinion based on knowledge of psychology, which I would use when creating a plot about a superhero. Other people have the right to write scripts the way they want.

I didn't understand what you meant in the last sentence.

Philo Kvetch, Who do you mean? I use an online translator, so I don't always fully understand the messages.

I don't know. I just dropped an edible.

Philo...how do you know you're not a member of the negative coffee clatch?

Whatever that means? LOL

How do you?

Ooops. Gotta go. Due at a coffee klatch.

You know. You remind me of that old saying...he showed up for a gun fight but forgot his bullets.

Preferred...over...showing up...with a load of...blanks.

'too many films about female superheroes who did not develop as individuals, but only promoted feminism. And they hoped to sell it to a male audience.'

So... nobody here but myself took notice of this particular set of words, along with the author of the post being from a particular place that has been cited for the practice of 'troll farming' with regards to the entertainment industry in USA, and has over 30 loglines and probably not that many written scripts whatsoever.

I read over the comments and didn't see much about the one of the most important changes regarding "super hero" movies. The biggest change is the audiences. Think about it: Flash Gordon (although not a super hero) was created in 1934; Superman, 1938; Captain America, 1940; Wonder Woman 1942; Bat Man 1934. There are other examples, too. What did all these "super" (meaning odd, powers,people) have in common? They were created in the first half of the 20th Century ---after the War to end all Wars (1918)--and then the reality that another war was coming/first started and it would worse than anything anyone had seen; and with the realization that SUPER weapons were a reality. Their creation also coincided with the "God is Dead" crowd. Intellectuals had Narnia, Lord of the Rings, a knowledge of Greek, Norse, and Roman gods, while ordinary people had "good guys" who, like gods, swooped in to protect the weak, save humanity, and punish miscreants. Today's version of the super hero saves "the (impersonal) universe". Like it or not, super heroes are part of Western Culture that spans 2 thousand & 23 years. Changing, appropriating, or replacing Western Culture means destroying substitutes for "good people" and feeling sorry for "sick, poor, oppressed" people. All the emotional support, morality lessons, and the power of virtue the heroes provided has evaporated. So have the audiences who became invested in them.

Jenean McBrearty, The Batman and Joker films have been modified, but are enjoying success. Please note that the Joker does not have a great struggle to save all of humanity or the universe, but the plot focuses on the psychology of the supervillain. Which confirms my opinion that psychology is important in a movie comic, not fighting.

I liked the Supergirl series while the heroine was hiding her identity and working as a journalist. As soon as they made her a super agent, I stopped watching this series.

Anthony A Miller, Are you accusing me of something? I don't quite understand the meaning of your message. what's wrong with my 30 loglines?

Great read, as a very active movie theater goer I really do not want to see another trailer for a Superhero much less the movie, except for many another Batman. I seem to remember my dad saying the superheros were there to give people hope during 1920's to 1950's global depression. He also said the comics were a very effective media to embarrass the public authority who maybe just as corrupt as they are now?

Do superheros exist only to save humanity? Why are "we" the stakes? Why can't they die? Why can't they battle moral corruption, public corruption, or greed.

Speaking of greed, might movie theater goers be willing to pay for a re-telling of David and Goliath in a grounded SCI-FI genre?

LogLine: Can a jinxed political activist dissuade the richest man in the world, from blasting off to his private colony on Mars taking all his tech with him, sending Earth back to the dark ages?

LogLine needs work but I have a great title.

Paul Rivers, You are absolutely right. Viewers are no longer interested in saving the world from the pixel demon.

they are interested in the behavior of superheroes who face the problems of modern society and culture.

How can Superman work and keep his place in the modern corporate media?

How can Batman keep the company in modern business conditions when shareholders want to replace him with a racially and gender diverse new director? And how can he deal with criminals if criminals are victims of poverty and systemic racism?

I wonder if film studios have used artificial intelligence to create scripts for failed movie comics? Maybe this is one of the reasons for the collapse of superhero films and the loss of audience interest in them?

Arthur Charpentier you really believe screenwriters & filmmakers hire to work on Superhero movies don't know story or character psychology?

..."The pattern arises from the fact that screenwriters pay little attention to the psychology of the hero.

And this is because the authors do not understand the essence of the superhero, its purpose in the plot..."

Dan MaxXx, understanding movies and understanding comics are two different things. comics have their own characteristics, they are not ready-made storyboards for movies. they need to be adapted like books.

Of course, film studios attract people experienced in cinematography to work, but this does not mean that they understand comics and are able to successfully adapt them for the film.

This is amazing and a little humorous to read. I think...

Like two titans of mythology bashing each other over the head with blunt objects.

my messages are not addressed to film business professionals, this is just an attempt to draw the attention of newcomers that comics and film comics require more psychological depth and elaboration. I'm sorry if any of the professionals were upset by my messages.

This year I've only watched two superhero movies - Black Adam and Guardians of the Galaxy 3. but I would like to watch more movies that won't disappoint. and I think a lot of other people want to see more good superhero movies too.

M LaVoie, I completely agree with you. films with a deep character and a strong dramatic character line are more successful than one-dimensional stories about super-agents who save the world from another super-enslavement or super-destruction.

Agree. That's why I personally think " Unbreakable" is best superhero film ever made.

Rutger Oosterhoff, movie comics with unusual plots and character development are remembered for a long time.

I have a similar idea for a series in which the hero considers himself a demon because he did not know that his visions of cruelty are not demonic possession but psychic abilities. https://www.stage32.com/profile/391912/Screenplay/Demon

Logline: Harley Quinn teams up with Batman to counter the villainous plans of the Joker and Poison Ivy. However, Harley Quinn does not suspect that she is the Joker's secret weapon, and must become the cause of Batman's madness.

As you can see, I focus in the logline on the psychological aspect of the relationship, and not on the action, which in any case will turn out to be another repetition.

pass. I dont "see" a movie.

Write the script and if you can execute, I will send to WME. Ari's ppl told me dont bother him unless I have a $1B idea. (Doesnt have to be mine)

Dan MaxXx, I don't know how to make blockbusters. but I know a little psychology and I think the audience would like to see Harley Quinn hook up with Batman.

Willem Elzenga ari sleeping fine in $10M+ mansion.

I admire people who have billion dollar ideas. :)

I have written a draft for Gotham movie where Batman influence is strongly felt although he is never in the movie himself. I want(ed) to sell it to Warner as 1b idea because the goal was to visually establish whole Gotham for XXI c. showing all districts. as clear that even theme park can be built. Or even further that you can experience this movie by going all around with virtual reality glasses and it would count to the box office earnings.

"After a lucky event Gotham madman with gambling problems becomes a hero. It inspires his therapy members to use his momentum for solving crimes together. Eventually they become hunted."

I wonder if the market has become too saturated. I found it impossible to keep up with the Marvel series. Too many crossovers etc. and the remakes (for woke purposes it seems mostly) are just dreadful.

David E. Gates, I've heard the opinion on YouTube that the audience of movie comics has grown rapidly and they want smarter movies. But film studios, on the contrary, began to make more stupid films. As a result, viewers who were teenagers ten years ago now have families and have chosen to stay at home to watch TV series and not go to the cinema.

Miroslavas Siniavskis, I like your idea for the movie. It is somewhat reminiscent of the movie Kick-Ass. I wish you good luck in promoting the project.

Arthur Charpentier maybe you like it to the level that you would love even collaborate? You should know that additionally to my poor English (I live in Lithuania) I have never made a movie and my WGA agency contract is expired.

Such ambition for one person can be too much to chew although when starting the project I believed it 100% :D

Kick-ass - I am watching it tonight! Trailer looks so entertaining! And only 30mil for Superhero movie the time when they were so profitable? I wonder is there much more movies in this genre with relatively low budgets intended for cinema goers?

Miroslavas Siniavskis, Unfortunately, I can't help you in any way, because I have nothing to do with the film business.

No problem, maybe I will find other collaborators then. Co-writer and great editor is needed. My movie is not working in many ways in terms of what good story filled with action moved by well established characters is.

But if you not, what are you doing in this platform?

Miroslavas Siniavskis, I'm on this site for communication and motivation.

I thought you needed help promoting the project, but I also don't want to be a co-author, because this is someone else's intellectual property.

That's amazing. Stage32 creators should be so proud!

No, I have a screenplay which is still in drafty level. So it can be categorised as fan fiction because I don't have franchise rights. If I will not get it but I will interest cinema community in making it then rewriting everything to new fictional city without any well known characters will be the way to do it.

With choosing such theme I tried to interest global cinema community in myself as a talent. I did even crazier marketing strategy on X :D

Miroslavas Siniavskis, so why limit yourself to one film studio and deprive yourself of copyright if you can create your own intellectual property?