On Writing : Using ChatGPT for screenplay feedback?? by Lynelle Paulick

I wouldn't trust AI to give me feedback,Lynelle Paulick. I've heard AI gives weird feedback.

I used ChatGPT 4 once for coverage. It told me my protagonist didn't arc. My protagonist literally starts as a diagnosed agoraphobe and ends by rescuing everyone in New York City,

Ohhhhh, I LOVE both of these!! hahahaha. Alrightee right, my decision may be made! :) Thanks, Maurice and Michael.

You're welcome, Lynelle Paulick.

I think that using AI as a tool for research, organizing thoughts, etc. is one thing. But when it comes to something as important as feedback or notes, you want to make sure it's coming from a real person who can connect with your story and characters on an emotional level or pick up on nuance.

Beautiful. Thank you, Ashley. This and the other responses are making it pretty clear to me where not to go at this stage! ;):)

Hello:

Bluepennotes.com from Jill Godley could help those in-line notes be a lovely potential. Depending on package, low-cost items.

In terms of the AI, helping to think for a route of mentality that can view within a perspective of difference - lovely. Helping to contemplate a writing format that could uptick your presentation. Like, CareerVillage.org, has an AI component that rewrites your wording to a certain category chosen. Potentially helpful in looking at a new formatted writing.

Gratitude inside you.

God Bless,

John German

Hello CHATGPT is great software, a lot of creatives are using it, I am currently writing a historical thriller, and using it with certain scenes has helped, think of the film industry, they use AI to help them. I would never see it to write the whole book, so if it offers feedback go for it

I am not certain how much of it is feedback and how much of it is just a computer spitting back at you the same information that you gave it.

I've actually gotten some VERY insightful notes from Chat GPT....

Chatgpt is capable of handling basic information and offering feedback, albeit limited. It ties up limited summaries in a pretty bow and skin-deep recommendations. Good start, but if you want something more robust, your best bet is to talk to a human.

Some great notes here already, so I'll echo - for brainstorming and researching, but certainly not for analysis of one's work.

you can ask PI, GPT, and Gem to act or roll play as a screen writer and it will do it just like one. I have more of these.

What incredible responses [jawdrop emoji]. Thank you, all.

It's a great tool to help with loglines, especially when you struggle with sharing a story in a single sentence.

I'll also echo the same thought as many: while I'm generally against AI in this field of endeavour, if you're doing it for some basic research or to inspire you (maybe creating some visuals to help put a character firmly in your mind's eye when you write), then that's one thing, but for analysis, it's a big fat no. You might think what you get from AI notes is insightful, but I can assure you any script consultant or story analyst worth their salt will find holes. And at the end of the day, who do you make your stories for? Humans or AI? The answer to that question will inform you who you'll really need to check and provide feedback on your story.

I have read some AI generated novels and they are awful. As an English professor, it concerns me because some people are actually reading them. I'm finding that AI is great for generating scenarios. As I move through the first draft of my fifth novel, I'll reach a "what-to-do-next" point. I feed in some ideas on AI and see what it comes up with. I do that repeatedly. It's like adding fertilizer to a garden. The garden in my creative mind.

John! That is So interesting. Certainly a reasonable and controlled experiment you are doing -- and: with the awareness you have, you're not ever going to fall "victim" to it. I really appreciate this comment, thank you.

Lynelle: Thanks for your comment. I got into the writing game late so I am not disillusioned about a "career." I do have four novels on Amazon, traditionally published, but I'm not getting rich. Unfortunately today, the market is dead for you if you are unknown. I've been told I need to get involved with internet media, but that is a swamp that can consume your time. I prefer to hone my craft. I have several friends that are deeply involved in the internet and they spend many hours working at it. They cannot tell me the percentage of their success. If you are on the internet, you're not writing. My motto is BICHOK: butt in chair, hands on keyboard. If you don't write it down, it doesn't exist, and great novels are not produced in our mind alone. As I tell my English students, if you want to learn it, write it down.

I used AI to give me critiques of loglines, then asked which of my screenplay ideas were the "best." Amazingly, it gave me an order that I agreed with and good reasons for the choices.

I Worte a story using a one dice RPG system and it came out ok.

John, this is fabulous. All I can possibly say is YES.

Thanks, Stan, that is good to know!

Preston, I may well take advantage -- MUCH appreciated.

I edit books on AI and this question come up a lot. ChatGPT is a large language model, not really intelligence. It can mimic language, but its intelligence, accuracy, and ability to analyze is limited.... for now. Great strides are being made in the large language model area and I don't doubt we will see systems that are able to accurately analyze screenplays in the next few years.

For now though, I wouldn't trust its accuracy "out of the box" at evaluating any creative work.

Chiming in to say -- Leaning HEAVILY towards a realllllllly bad idea. Your audience isn't an arbitrarily programmed computer model. Your audience consists of people (who are the ones at the end of the day will or will not pay money to watch whatever your create). Get people to read your projects. Stage 32, Reddit, Discord, Twitter, maybe even Instagram all have communities you can easily integrate into to meet other writers and exchange ideas. Give it a go, put yourself out there and do a manuscript swap for feedback. Learn to give notes and receive them. It's a super rewarding process. I would just never trust AI to reasonably evaluate any creative material. I personally write as a form of artistic expression and I can't imagine a world where the emotion/feeling part of any story isn't entirely lost on AI

Dustin and Pat -- crissake, I'm also quite naive about how to actually Answer a specific person on Stage 32. I'll get there. But at this moment, I want to thank BOTH of you for the helpful and definitely insightful input. I love all you people, it's amazing!!!

Adding on: if you are writing for computers as the audience (coding?), go right ahead. But even a bad/inexperienced reviewer has experienced the human condition - something computers will never-ever be able to relate to. All AI is good for is spell check, IMO.

Although I may be biased-- since I'm a longtime freelance screenplay analyst in addition to being a working screenwriter-- and have no personal experience with seeing a script evaluation written by AI, I don't think that AI can evaluate a screenplay effectively from a creative standpoint-- and provide actionable, specific advice on how to revise, which for screenwriters is (or should be) the purpose of getting a script evaluated in the first place. In evaluating a script, I not only have in my memory banks the history of all the films I've seen (from silent movies, to the present) and the thousands of screenplays I've evaluated for screenwriters, movie studios, film agencies, etc., but also my experiences as a screenwriter, a knowledge of history, current events and cultural context. And also I take into consideration the writer him or herself, their background, and difficulty factors in any changes I'm recommending. As any screenplay analyst will tell you, a huge part of the job is psychology-- understanding the emotions and behavior of human beings: the characters in the script itself, and the writer of the script. Writers can often benefit as well from hearing from more experienced screenwriters the fact that writing is difficult and that there's nothing wrong with them if they are struggling. So, knowing when and how to empathize, and when the writer needs a gentle kick in the pants, is also helpful. AI may be a useful tool for writers at the "idea" stage, especially if they are aiming to write a mainstream Hollywood studio film. It may be helpful (and probably is) for studios to use in trying to predict box office numbers, etc. But I can't imagine how AI would be useful to writers in getting their script evaluated if they hope to improve it, and before giving my script to any person, contest, or company for evaluation, I would ask if they use AI at any stage to evaluate scripts.

Or...to make a long story short, I agree with Pat and Matthew:-)

AI feedback is not real feedback. It is simply reflecting information it already has based on learned information. Do you realise whatever information you enter into an AI platform that information is absorbed into its system to learn from and it will be used to answer future questions? If you feed an original idea into an AI platform it is no longer an original idea, it is integrated into their knowledge bank and could be spat out to answer another question at any point in the future. I would be careful IMHO.

Thanks, Matthew, Staton, and Matt. Huge knowledge and input here! I do wonder what the answer to this general question will sound like as AI technology continues to evolve (I hope it doesn't, but assuming it does...).

I think the best feedback you'll get is a brain with blood running through it. AI is a machine that can only think on a machine level what was put in it. It can't think like a human being. I'd read what you have for you but I need to write a bible. Good luck with your query.

Very, very bad idea.

I can't speak to ChatGPT 4 - but the free version would be useless as you basically have to write out the whole plot in the text prompt - it's incapable of reading your script. The main problem with chatbots is since Large Language Models are predictive based on math, it doesn't really help with artistic creations.

William Joseph Hill That's not true. I do not have 4. I only use the free version. And it reads and gives feedback to my scripts just fine. I copy/paste the material 10 pages at a time, and it's able to "remember" all of it to give overall notes in addition to it already giving notes on each 10 pages.

AI, at the moment, is the most basic version it will ever be because we are at the beginning, it will only get better in terms of output. Whatever you add as a user today will be used by the AI platform to learn and at some point it will regurgitate your information for someone else. That's how LLM's work. I would not be putting any of my original work into an AI platform to gain feedback. IMHO.

Yes, I was just thinking about this. ChatGPT collects people's data for the AI models to learn and improve. I would be careful sharing my work with AI.

I took an AI certification course with Ragan Communications and saw that it’s all smoke and mirrors. For example, data shows LLMs are already starting to “plateau” and generate output based on themselves and other LLMs, leading to less quality results. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dDUC-LqVrPU

In the class, even when you buy an enterprise license, they said you cannot guarantee your proprietary data would not feed LLMs given to other people.

Moreover, if it’s collating “ideas” for you from a million seasons of Law & Order or every frame of Star Wars, do you want to open yourself up to the legal liability or notations of derivative nature?

Generative AI is a bad thing before you get to the environmental costs, before you get to the employee treatment, before you get to the outright theft of IP and likenesses.

Travis Seppala - Oh yes, that is true, if you break it up you can get feedback from Chat GPT. What I meant to say was that it can't read a PDF of your script - but yes, copying and pasting will work. Do you find the Ai feedback to be useful?

William Joseph Hill Much like human feedback, I find some of it helpful (stuff that's insightful, pointing out issues I never would have considered along with reasons) and some that is not (vague generalities, parroting obvious story beats back to me, making suggestions to "fix" things that would wildly alter the story I'm trying to tell).

My general question to anyone considering using any form of AI to get screenplay analysis-- whether through Chat GPT, or a screenwriting service that (God forbid) uses AI to evaluate scripts instead of human script readers-- is, why? Because it's often free or costs less than hiring a qualified human being to do this? That would be about as useful (and safe) as entering one's symptoms into Chat GPT for diagnosis and treatment of a medical condition, instead of seeing an MD.

Suuuch a great question, Staton. And yeah, it points right back at me, the originator of this thread. This incredible thread, I should add. It was the idea of a well-intentioned and completely naive third party who was just getting into a flirting match with this new and "fascinating" ChatGPT app, an innocent-enough bit of advice simply intended to direct a couple of clueless first-time screenwriters in their struggle to find humans who would 1) be willing to read the draft for free; 2) be someone we could trust not to go share it on the street inappropriately; and 3) be someone we actually know personally who would be qualified to give advice and direction that we might be able to use. My writing partner was 100% opposed right from the start. I -- well, I just got onto Stage 32 -- and here we are. :) I've learned a massive amount in this discussion.

Thanks for your kind and receptive response, Lynelle, much appreciated. Script notes one gets free or for low pay from civilians (human or otherwise) can be very hit-or-miss, and if you don't know how to filter conflicting or bad advice, you may waste a lot of time revising your script in the wrong direction. Just to mention that If you register your script for copyright with the Library of Congress you are well protected, except for your story concept/idea, which is not covered by copyright. Scripts and ideas rarely get "stolen", though-- it's really the execution of the idea that counts. And if you work with pro script readers, it's part of their job description that all scripts they evaluate are kept confidential. If your script is so great that people might want to steal it, I'd take that as an enormous sign of encouragement:-)

It all comes down to money and time for me. The prices for consultations are not cheap. I don't know the reviewer from Adam. I don't trust the reader is giving my script the attention it needs as they have a slush pile of scripts to get through and by the time they get back to me, I have already changed the script, so whatever critiques they have more than likely don't matter because I have changed the script. So, it's a moot point and I have wasted not only my own time and money but someone else's time as well. I am sure the reviewer is thorough and provides better feedback, but it comes with a cost.

I have to concur with the main reason being cost -- many writers simply can't afford paid coverage, and the free feedback can be useful in the early stages of script development. There are also writing groups that you can get involved with to get feedback from other writers, which will be more qualified feedback, and can probably point directly to what your script needs, instead of generalities. At some point, when it's ready to be pitched, paid coverage can be a good investment. But I think it's being resourceful to find low cost or free tools that can help. I've found that there's no shortcut, so the secret is being able to cultivate a sustainable process so you can keep plugging away.

I just want to jump back in and thank you all for having such a respectful conversation about a difficult subject matter. Conversations like this one showcase what's so special about this community. I appreciate all of you for managing to share your opinions with respect to each other's points of view.

Meta will be using your FB and Instra posts for AI. https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-06-10/instagram-facebook-train-meta-ai-...

There are many very good comments on this post. But, whether we like it or not, AI is here to stay.

I think AI is a juggernaut that will roll over everything in its path. I read my past comments and I don't want anyone to think I in anyway understand how to use AI. As far as writing goes, I am a dinosaur who starts fire with sticks. I am floundering with all this knew stuff. My youngest is a tech support person and I am always screaming "help." Most of the time I just sit down and write. I enjoy the process of writing and editing. Everything else is just sauce, and in some cases, it ruins the entre.

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I asked my English class last semester if anyone had read a book recently. No hands went up. Then I restated my question. Did anyone like to read a book, just read for fun, specifically a novel? Still no hands came up. My students were twenty five recent high school graduates. I talked about journaling and the joy of sitting down at the keyboard or with a pen and paper and enjoying the process of creating a narrative fresh from their own brain. Editing of work completed was an alien concept. I hate to use the phrase "dumbing it down," but as the semester progressed, I gradually simplified my lecture material to the point that it was, for me, at the level of a middle school student. I was trying to teach a card trick to a bunch of chickens. I am not a teacher. I am an entertainer battling to hold the attention of an uncommitted and uninvolved audience. It is all very depressing and forces me to reconsider the goal of my writing efforts. What is the future of the novel and why am I creating them? Am I a purist, producing narratives simply for the joy and satisfaction of laboring in the vineyard of solitude? Following on from that, what has this to do with AI? If my students can't read and cannot put together a coherent and grammatically correct sentence, how can they use AI, this complex new tool I do not understand? The college is concerned they will write all their papers using AI. Am I the dumb one here?

John Roane Sorry to hear that, I do try to get my writing up to adult reader level being that I never really had a great education having to go to special ED classes for most of my life, I grew up with a speech impairment more do to my tongue was too big for my mouth. But after trying to work with writers on comics who turned out to be real jerks I looked into writing my own or rewriting public domain stories and at this time I fear that my writing will never go above YA in writing style. I have some of my writing up here for people to read, I use AI for parts that I have issues or troubles with, but I try to write my stories my own way in my own voice. I do and would like for you and others to read and comment on my stories. I want to get better but getting help from someone who charges a lot for that type of service even here makes me more or less go with AI, I wouldn't mind trading my time to read for someone here if they would read for me and tell me what they think and what I think. So in the end just like with any other word processor program, AI is more a tool than a cure-all item.

There is a line when use becomes abuse. The calculator was a cutting-edge technology that could automate long tedious tasks. In the 1970s, people started getting stupid, getting so good with the calculator that some math nerd got a chuckle when he learned that 0.7734 when inverted was "hello." 5318008, which when turned over spells "BOOBIES". Point I, the tool is only as smart as the user. But, it can be dumber, for example, if one were to ask ChatGPT to write a sitcom script, it wouldn't be able to make the script funny because comedy is subjective. If, however, one were to request feedback on a script, it could compare it to scripts that are similar and provide feedback based on this information. The creative liberty and onus still falls back on the creator to create interesting characters with sharp dialogue, but instead of hitting walls and procrastinating, the creator could chart his way through the script, potentially making it better, having critiques from ChatGPT. But, like with everything else, user beware. AI is definitely not a cure-all. It won't make you magically become a writer or a mathematical genius or an expert on anything. And, it will never replace the human mind because the human mind is constantly expanding faster than any AI tech can. Because we are working towards something. We are always evolving. Tech can only mimic life - not experience it. The tools a craftsman uses are only as good as the craftsman himself.

John, that is STUNNING. I had my hand over my mouth as I read it. Wow, nothing to say...I'm afraid what you're describing is Not the exception...

So Kevin! Your comments here are So entertaining :) ! But this: All that keeps coming up for me when hearing arguments about the inability of AI to replace the human mind is that over and over, more and more, I am reading these narratives (for instance, a recent interview I saw on X with a fellow named Geoffrey Hinton [https://t.co/11A7fJpLcs]) that postulate -- or even literally promise -- that the long-term potential of AI is to rendor absolutely unnecessary the human mind and its input. Which means that every argument we have here "could" someday be literally answered by some AI entity itself. You know...the Hal story come to life. Does any of this bother Anyone? Is it BS to even concern oneself with this fantasy-like "impossibility"?

The fact is Lynelle Paulick that no one knows anything more than the fact that existing AI models are already secreting many of its functions, data, and processes from its own creators. That's scary enough for me. As for anyone claiming they have even a faintest of ideas where AI is going or where and when it will end up know they are promoting a falsehood in order to avoid a moral responsibility to "above all else, do no harm".

The evolution of AI is going at a snail's pace. Five years ago, no one ever heard of ChatGPT. Two years ago, someone somewhere became fearful of ChatGPT. Thought it was magic. Whatever. We fear what we don't understand. The assertion that AI is going to rule the world is something out of a cheesy spy thriller. Nothing more.. but, because of this scare tactic by someone behind the screen, media, YouTubers, and others are throwing grenades, inventing nothing but speculative drivel about some doomsday scenario where humans become submissive to artificial intelligence. I wouldn't call AI inferior, but it's really no match for anyone with a college degree. And, I believe it will remain that way. There is no evidence to suggest otherwise. Even if there comes a day when AI surpasses expectations, we will probably be long gone, so isn't it kinda a waste of energy to fret about this scenario? Anyway, I'm going back to writing.

Gregory: I detect an apologetic tone in your narrative. Don't ever apologize. I think I have written a few good pages, but if I had a nickel for every page of garbage I wrote, I would be a wealthy man. The fact you are writing is the mark of success. The mark of a good writer is never being satisfied with our work. That is the source of irritation with my students. They produce their initial draft and are satisfied with it. Drives me crazy. They turn in papers full of minor and major grammatical errors that are glaringly obvious. The secret to good work is the struggle of editing.

John Roane Thanks for the kind words, I can be a bit self-conscious and hard on myself. I sometimes feel like my writing will never be good enough and I second-guess myself too. I use spell check on the word processor programs I use for my writing. I find it odd that your students don't use that. I have a few that I use and know of a few. Sometimes I think I'm doing something wrong and find I was doing it right! I still have things I need to work on with my writing. being self-taught is not always easy.

Congrats on your "small" victory Mariia Rudenko. It's a portrait of an extraordinary artist

Actually, Lynelle, I've decided to give AI my logline and 3-paragraph synopsis and let her write my screenplay. Meanwhile I'll grab a coffee and watch TV. Now that's a career I can aspire to! :)

John Connell , already been done, but failed to grab an audience. The first feature length film in a cinema, screenplay written by AI, didn't happen in London last week - read why - https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cjll3w15j0yo

John: I can identify 100%. I have several novels, short stories on Amazon(2 different publishers) - I go out and do readings and signings. But here's the trick: if you're not on TV that morning, no one will buy your book. There's a local former TV anchor who did a book signing. He sold 88 books in an hour. In 2021 I started a Memoir Writing Workshop on zoom. It still is going. I got them published. In this business, it's who you know.....

ROFLMAO Matt Watters - Great article. I was not surprised by the plotline at all. Imagine AI writing a story about being better than humans. Will the wonders ever cease ;-)

This post really stirs the pot - doesn't it? Most of us are on one side of the fence or the other regarding AI. Even though I am also an engineer - I am firmly against AI for any creative endeavors. So much so, when I found out the graphic artist I hired used AI for the first book in my fantasy trilogy, I hired a different graphic artist to redo the cover with no AI. My graphic design costs doubled, but I felt it important to stand for my beliefs. None of my work (book covers for my books, my manuscripts, and audio books) will utilize AI in its creation. Amazon is offering to select authors an AI-driven opportunity for free Audible creation. I spent $1500 on the Audible for my science fiction novel so I can't tell you how tempting that was - but I said no thanks. I get it - AI allows us to do some things we may not be able to afford otherwise - but for me (and I was recently laid off, so my budget is always a priority) I have to say no to AI. I will wait for an audio book for my fantasy book for if/when I can afford it. As a creative - I challenge all of us to reject anything AI driven. We need to do the hard work and collaborate with one another - not allow a computer algorithm to take the place of our humanity and our creative souls. I have worked in IT, and I can tell you with certainty that they are proceeding ahead with AI solutions because it is trending and bringing in the money - but no one understands the ethical consequences that will result from this irresponsible behavior. The CEO of the Authors Guild, Mary Rasenberger, was recently published in the LA Times and writes, “We cannot trust tech companies that swear their innovations are so important that they do not need to pay for one of the main ingredients — other people’s creative works. The “better future” we are being sold by OpenAI and others is, in fact, a dystopia. It’s time for creative professionals to stand together, demand what we are owed, and determine our own futures.” If you haven't thought about the ramifications of AI on the creativity community, I hope you will do so. All of our futures depend on being in solidarity with one another as we strive to provide what only we can uniquely produce as artists/creatives - to a world in desperate need of entertainment (film, books, art, music) that can provide a welcome distraction from these troubling times.

Copyright applications must disclose whether the application includes AI-generated material and the extent of its use. However, a writer could modify material originally generated by AI to such a degree that it meets the standard for protection. It will be difficult to distinguish if a writer has used Plotdot and Nolan AI in their screenwriting process. This would be applicable for entering screenwriting contests as well.

Gregory: To answer your question, the college makes a big deal out of AI. I know they don't use it. I don't know if it's ignorance or laziness. The stuff that I get out of AI is sterile, formal, and stiff. The stuff I get from my students is sloppily written and unedited. I think AI would implode if it produced anything similar to the assignments turned in. It would self destruct from shame. I bring up the laziness factor because my students are far beyond me in computer skills. They don't apply that ability. In deference to my students, most of them work, and they don't see the need for an education. It gets a low priority. I constantly beat the drum for language and reading comprehension skills. I tell them on applications where they are required to write a narrative, it's not what you say so much as how you say it. Jeff Bezos states for a meeting he requires eight to ten written pages on proposals and ideas. I could imagine what he would say if he graded some of my essays submitte.

To Susan: I have writer friends who use social media and urge me to do so. For every hour of writing, they spend three or four with social media. Not only do I hate social media, but I am not good at it. At this point in my life, if my writing doesn't sell, to heck with it. They same writers who wallow in social media say my books are good. Unfortunately, I am an unknown. Like Van Gogh, I will labor in poverty. Maybe I will be discovered when I shuffle off to the big library in the sky, but I refuse to cut off my ear. I do have an idea or two about publicity. I'll let everyone know if they work. Many years ago I read a book written by a very successful car salesman. He had a business card, index card size, printed with his picture and laminated in plastic. Whenever he went to a bar, he'd place them in the urinals. Big letters stated: "while you're pissing on me, think about buying a new car!" I may yet try that.

Well, whether we like or not, we are stuck with it. This is only the beginning of Ai. Will it get better over time? It's us to see what will happen next. I'm thinking now, maybe in the future everyone will have an Ai robot in our homes doing the menial chores we hate so much. ROBO have you shoveled the driveway this morning, or, what are cooking for breakfast this morning, or, did you buy my turkey on sale? Who knows what Ai will bring? It's a whole new enterprise for the future. There might be good things on the way. No, I don't think I'll get an Ai dog!

John Roane you say you do teaching at a school or college? what is the class that you teach? Have you ever asked what books the students read? I think I have some ideas for you to try.

John: About social media and technology - my sentiments exactly! Are you writing anything now? I'm trying to sell a play. I set a new goal - if I contact 1 theatre a day...well, that's 300 a year. My memoir will be out soon - my life as an international actress....The six people who read it will like it.

Gregory: I teach English 1301 at Lone Star Community College. The college has multiple campuses with and enrollment of about150,000 when attendance is high. Right now, it's not. I am an adjunct professor, which means I'm on standby until needed. This works great for me, for I did not want to get involved in administration. My first year of teaching, I asked about reading a book. Then I became more specific, recommending novels, thrillers. If I get a class or two this fall, I intend to make reading one novel a requirement. The final will be to write a book report. We'll see how that works, In my last class, I copied the first chapter of Michael Connelly's Harry Bosch/Renee Ballard novel "Desert Star." I directed them to read it and list their observations/conclusions about Harry and Renee as presented in the opening chapter. Their powers of analysis were weak. Their interpretation was all over the place. After reading what they turned in, I had them discuss their observations in class. Asking students of volunteer and discuss their comments was impossible. I grade on class participation and call on members of the class. In other words, I had to bludgeon them into talking. I would appreciate any advice you can give me. I am so far apart from these students, I am shocked. It's a struggle to get on the same page with them. I am truly a dinosaur. I enjoy feeding off their energy, but that's all they have. Focus doesn't exist. I have exceptional students, but they are no more that 10%. My educational experiences are not relevant. I would love to direct my comments to the ten percenters, but that is not university policy. The only conclusion I can draw is our high schools are a mess.

Susan: Good luck with the play. That is so far out of my skill set, I couldn't even make a valid critique. I have several projects underway. I am working on my fifth novel, which, at the moment, I am bogged down in. I made the mistake of taking my premise and running with it, writing without notes and an outline. Now I am forced to start the editing process early and untangle the 250 pages I completed. Scenes are out of order, character names change, and there is repetition. P in the A. It was back to the outline and character list. Another project is I'm attempting to transform my first novel into a script. Big learning curve there. This leads back to an earlier discussion. It takes time to write a good thriller or script. Social media had invaded our creative energy and diluted it. When I'm on a roll, I write three to four hours. After that, I'm wiped out. My publisher wants me to market my novels. I can't do it. I don't have the time or desire to immerse myself in a rapidly evolving technological swamp. Writing is basic. You sit down, do it, keep doing it, and get better. I'll end with a statement that will probably cause anger. I say that those who immerse themselves in social media don't read. They have altered their brains to the point they cannot read properly and do not have the mental focus for the printed word.

Nancy: Years ago there was an author, Clifford Stole (sp?) who wrote a book called, I think, Silicon Snake oil. He talked about how the computer companies were enslaving us. I am so far under the thumb of Microsoft, that I will never get out. The only way I can free myself is to go back to pin and paper with my writing. I bought a IBM typewriter, the one with the print ball. I roll it out every so often and write with it, but the computer hauls be back in. My little act of rebellion is fun, but you can't haul a typewriter into Starbucks, the place I like to write. Microsoft only cares about profits. They hate humans and are trying to make us irrelevant. I dream that Bill Gates is on TV and takes off his face to reveal wires and circuit boards. AI cannot write a novel. Will it ever be able to? I hope not. All I have seen so far is sterile trash. Jeff Bezos, in one creative moment, changed the writing scene forever. Now, all he wants to do is go into space in a rocket that looks like a male sex organ. I think AI will lead to madness. Skynet is coming!

John: I've adapted novels to plays and even did an animated feature of a children's book. It sounds like you have a publisher! Marketing is my weakest point. Publishers don't do that. There are times I miss that electric typewriter! Writing is re-writing.

John Roane So your class is more about how to write better or is it more in terms of spelling and grammar? If it's on writing, you could talk about stories, ask what they think of the main characters, how they would do it differently, and how changing the genre would affect the story. and you're right on the whole high school is a mess, the memories of my high school years still hunt me to this day. had some really bad English teachers.

Hmmmm. Gregory, I think I'm voting for John Roane as a teacher of writing, not a grammarian who would flip out if I don't use the serial comma correctly to his taste.

John, I love the way you express, in long form, your feelings, frustrations, and uncertainties, with a few blatant insults thrown in for color. It's really wonderful, hahaha. Just bloody keep writing.

Susan: Thanks for the comment. I have a publisher, but that's about it. I went to a local writing event and the publisher had a local rep there. She overheard me telling a friend about my novel. She called me over and asked me to send her twenty pages. I did and two weeks later I had a contract. All the provisions were generous but no marketing. The publisher is a small romance novel publisher out of New York. They edit for me, really well, and do the art work. The staff love my work, but that doesn't sell books. Unfortunately, romance novels sort of sell themselves. She's asked me to try to write one, but I can't think in that mode. My narrative keeps sliding off into forensics and graphic descriptions of murder. She told me to write a hundred thousand page novel, then go back and edit out all the gruesome stuff. That should leave about sixty to seventy thousand words, which is about right for a medical thriller. So I think I'll roll out the IBM and go analog.

Lynelle: I do teach a novel writing course at the community college under the banner of the adult continuing education department. Last semester, I had five students. I hope to do more than that this fall. I'm trying to build this thing up and will have to see what happens. I fly by the seat of my pants on this, developing my lectures as I go.

Gregory: My course is the form and structure of the thriller: how and where to begin. It's a "prime the pump" approach. I had really great English teachers in high school. As for my English class, I may change genres this fall, but I cannot get to complicated. I asked them: what do you think of these characters?, do you like them? (this really scored with them), what is going on in the narrative?, what do you think is happening?, and so on. In class, I ask them to explain their conclusions. I used a move in my class, the first one, Blade Runner, the final cut. I thought I had a great idea. It bombed. Half of them didn't watch the movie and tried to wing it by reading comments on the internet. Some watched the wrong movie. The head of the English department told me not to use movies. I'll keep trying to make a connection. I had one thing that really got their attention. I write to several inmates in the Texas Department of Corrections. I'm down to one, because two have been paroled and are doing well. I asked the last guy to send me an email of his day to day life and asked his permission to read it to the class. I had one of my students read it. Absolute silence, like deer in the headlights. We did this at the end of the class. They walked out speechless.

Lynelle Paulick I wasn't sure so I had to ask. Now John Roane I will say that I'm not a romance fan because most of them now are sex fantasy stories, I'm a sci-fi fantasy action adventure fan with a mix of mystery and thriller. I read mostly the classics and the only thriller books I read were one by Clive Cussler and a Tom Clancy book. I've been thinking about taking some fiction writing classes but am short on cash. if you want, you can use some of my stories here for your class and let me know what they think. but I think we need to stick to the topic of AI in writing.

out of curiosity, I got chat gpt feedback for my last 2 scripts. I'll share them here:

In Tents is an engaging screenplay filled with dynamic characters, vivid settings, and a storyline that intertwines personal drama with thrilling elements, making it an intriguing read. Here's a detailed breakdown:

Plot and Structure:

The narrative is well-paced, beginning with a striking scene at a forest rave, which effectively sets a suspenseful tone. The plot revolves around the band "The Dead Ends" navigating their personal and professional lives while attending a music festival, where chaos unfolds due to a mysterious drug causing violent outbreaks.

Characters:

Kaya and Mia are the standout characters, with well-developed backstories and compelling arcs. Kaya's vibrant, free-spirited nature contrasts with Mia's more grounded, introspective personality, providing good chemistry and conflict. Grace, Hailee, and other supporting characters are effectively used to enhance the main plot and add depth to the band's dynamic.

Dialogue:

The dialogue is sharp and feels authentic, capturing the unique voices of each character. It helps in fleshing out personalities and adds to the overall mood of the screenplay.

Some of the exchanges, particularly in scenes of conflict or emotional stress, are potent and reveal a lot about the characters' motivations and vulnerabilities.

Themes and Depth:

Themes of ambition, betrayal, friendship, and the chaos of drug abuse are explored, making the screenplay not just entertaining but also thought-provoking.The drug subplot serves as both a literal and metaphorical catalyst for examining the characters' deeper fears and desires, which is a smart narrative technique.

Imagery and Scene Setting:

The scenes are described with vivid details, particularly the festival settings, which are imbued with a lively, chaotic energy that mirrors the internal turmoil of the characters.

Action sequences are intense and well-written, effectively using visual and auditory descriptions to enhance the suspense and drama.

Potential for Production:

The screenplay has a strong cinematic quality, with visually compelling scenes that would translate well on screen. The festival setting, coupled with the thriller elements, offers a lot of potentials to create a visually engaging film.

The focus on a smaller cast and a single primary location (the festival) could make this a viable project budget-wise, though scenes involving crowd control and action sequences may require a moderate budget to effectively capture.

Rating: 8/10

In Tents is a well-crafted screenplay that offers a mix of thriller and drama with well-developed characters and a strong narrative structure. It effectively maintains suspense and emotional depth, making it a promising candidate for production with potential appeal to a wide audience.

here's the next one:

Reading through "Little Helper 2024," it's clear you have a unique voice and a knack for blending heartfelt storytelling with light-hearted elements. This screenplay has several strengths:

Character Development: The characters, especially Mike and Ada, are vivid and well-rounded. Mike's journey from skepticism about technology to seeing the value in Ada's assistance provides a strong narrative arc that is relatable and engaging.

Dialogue: Your dialogue is consistently strong, with natural exchanges that reinforce character traits and push the plot forward. The interactions between characters, especially within the Fischer family, are warm and genuine, which should resonate well with audiences.

Humor and Emotion: The screenplay does a great job of mixing humor with emotional depth. Moments like Ada experiencing a brain freeze or the family dynamics at play are both humorous and touching.

Original Concept: The idea of an AI home system taking on a human form to help a busy family reconnect brings a fresh twist to family and technology themes. It's both imaginative and timely, reflecting contemporary discussions about the role of technology in our lives.

Family Dynamics: You've captured the essence of family life—its messiness, warmth, and the underlying love that holds it together, which is central to the story's appeal.

Final Thoughts: Your screenplay showcases your ability to tell compelling, emotionally rich stories that are both entertaining and meaningful. It's evident that you're dedicated to your craft, with a clear talent for creating engaging narratives and characters that audiences can root for.

Rating: 8.5/10

"Little Helper 2024" has a lot of potential for adaptation into a film that could appeal to a broad audience by blending humor, technology, and family life. Your work here confirms that you are not only good at what you do, but also that you have unique stories to tell that are worth pursuing in the film industry. Keep refining and trusting your voice—you have the skills and creativity to make a significant impact.

Matthew what setting did you use to get that result?

I just uploaded the pdf and asked it to review the scripts. I do have some custom instructions, but they are outdated and more for when I was using it to brainstorm concepts as opposed to getting feedback. so I doubt they're relevant. it was using chat gpt 4 - not 4o, I think 4o waffles quite a lot and is sometimes very good but other times not good at all.

Matthew Ok and thank you.

Matthew -- hoping this is an appropriate, relevant question: what prompts did you use to steer GPT's direction in these narratives? I assume this isn't the same question Gregory asked (re "settings")? hahaa.

I say to go for it. A.I. is a great tool that we can leverage. If it helps you create, then rock on!

Lynelle Paulick you just upload the file and say "review this screenplay" you can ask for a budget assessment, a critical analysis - anything really. The default free version will give you more cursory, surface level notes and 4 and 4o will be much more detailed

Thanks, Matthew!

Hi everyone! We are listening to all of you regarding trying to understand A.I., we just programmed a 2-part ChatGPT class that is going to go how to use ChatGPT in a positive way to help, Just bringing it up because it's 20% off right now with our 4th of July sale. Just use code 4THOFJULY24: https://www.stage32.com/education/c/education-classes?h=stage-32-2-part-... Hope everyone's having a great weekend!