Success Stories: JUN'17 Pitching…It’s All a Crap Shoot!

CONGRATULATIONS Mark Palmer for not quiting. Just when we think it is done, then something like what happened to you occurs. It really depends on what the Produer is looking for as well. You should do a reality docu-series on your cruise ship life. Others are doing it on Youtube and are making a really good living and getting their names out there. Wish ya tha best of luck. Cheers!

Thanks Mark Deuce!

Congratulations on the meeting request, Mark Palmer! Hope the meeting leads to great things for you!

There are so many factors that go into whether a pitch is going to land or not, Mark Palmer. There's the obvious, the entire process is subjective. Then there's perceived marketability and whether the material is a fit for that prod co.

When I was pitching the show that sold to Amblin, we had another pitch that day which I believed was going to be the perfect fit for that prod co. It fell completely flat. On the flip side, I didn't believe Amblin would be interested and we had a deal 3 days later.

So yes, "keep pitching" is always the answer. So is treating networking and relationship building as a job. Embrace the long game, keep opening doors and put as many lines in the water as possible.

And understand, meeting requests don't come easy. Executives value their time too much, as they should. So celebrate that you hit one out of the park and focus on nailing that meeting!

Mark Palmer That’s amazing! Congratulations

Thanks Maurice Vaughan

You're welcome, Mark Palmer.

Thank you for sharing this pitching anecdote, Mark. I found the entire story fascinating and truly inspiring.

Oh wow! That is incredible. Not many "welcome home" presents could be better than that!

Good for you, Mark. I could use some help of my own.

Congratulations, Mark!

Wow! Congratulations! This is why they say that “One man’s meat is another man’s poison.”

Thanks for sharing this, Mark.

Congratulations! This is the dilemma I'm currently having with my pitch sessions. I have so many vastly different opinions on my work, which have all led to disappointments. However, I hope to hear a change really soon. Thank you for sharing!

YOU GOT THIS Karmin Mosley no matter what keep writing and creating. The more you create the more chances you have of success. Cheers!

You had mentioned the fishing analogy of multiple lines in the water. The similar analogy would be also making multiple casts.

The advice I always stick to in Hollywood comes from this Oscar-winning screenwriter:

"Nobody knows anything." --- William Goldman

Francisco Castro took the words out of my mouth! :)

William Goldman's blunt assessments were generally true and always crack me up. xD

Everything is subjective. Mark Palmer just keep pitching -- and know you are now in a position to turn the tables. You know that you have a viable pitch and now you're looking for the people who get it. We tend to look at rejection the wrong way. It's not a prison. Instead, rejection is freeing -- giving you the opportunity to find the people who get you and your story. Good luck and I'm looking forward to reading more about your journey.

Good story and thank you for sharing. This is like anything else, very subjective.

It's luck. Sometimes you hit with the right person. It has nothing to do with the quality of the work. And that's the tough part. I started out as an actress. At my first class (Boston University), the professor (David Pressman) told us:

"If there are are two things you love to do and one of them is act, do the other."

Being a boxing writer, I always think about the words of an old trainer "You can give out; but never give up."

Colleen: I'm interested in learning more about 'boxing writer' because I have a novel (and the play) called The Australian Featherweight.

Yes Mark - rejection is a gut punch when received. But a good project will eventually find the "right fit". Good luck.

Rejection can be detrimental to you if you stay focused on it. Just try your best at making your pitch concise, straight-forward and dynamic, without giving too much away.

There's something to be learned from every "No". And once you reframe rejection as a learning experience, it's much easier to handle.

Ditto "RB"....

Sometimes a "no" is a test ot see how committed you are to your vision. And you're right...it is a crap shoot. It's subjective. So keep going. Let this be a lesson...don't give up on yourself before you find your yest. It could be just an arm's reach away. Congratulations!

Mark Palmer You took away the single most important lesson from this experience..."KEEP PITCHING"!! Stay the course and keep learning!

Oh pitch fast balls and curve balls and underhand. Just don't leave the mound. I mean, Stallone said he went to 100 meets before Rocky wasn't laughed out of the offices. Casablanca bombed when it was first released. Poe died penniless. So many of these stories. And then a whole pile of crap gets made. Part numbers game, a lotta luck, and tenacity. I guess we all need to ask the right questions of ourselves "why am I doing this? Is is for the art of storytelling or to make a buck? Or both?" Anyway, let's not let doubt creep into our magic.

As William Goldman said, nobody knows anything. It's all subjective. Even if you get something made the same is true. Not everyone will go see it. Of those that do, many won't like it. But I agree it can be baffling when reactions from an educational service can be so divergent. I paid extra for notes as part of a competition once and they were so poor I had to complain. The reviewer had misunderstood the genre in the first couple of pages and then gave me notes based on their misperception. I paid for this? My kid could have done better. But glad you found the right person in the end!!

Congratulations, Mark!

Great story my friend, success, may the best projects come for the rest of this year...

Amazing news! I’m happy to hear you persisted and didn’t jump ship (see what I did there). What’s meant for you won’t miss you. It’s when we want things to go according to our plan that God laughs.

Congratulations. Big step. Hope it goes farther!

Thank you so much for sharing this. It makes me feel like I have a chance.

Bravo! Timing and persistence!

Congratulations, Mark. That's show business for you. I had two industry professionals read my pilot. One absolutely loved it and wanted to do a Zoom call with me to discuss my writing. The other said he couldn’t finish it because he thought what I wrote would never happen. Keep in mind, what I wrote is based on the murder of my sister. So there you go, some love you, some don't.

My condolences, Sardia Robinson.

Thanks, Maurice.

You're welcome, Sardia Robinson.

So sorry Sardia for your loss. I can't even imagine negating what happened to your sister in real life! So many in Hollywood would rather make stuff up and diss true stories that are infinitely more fascinating.

Sorry about your sister. Someone I know was in an abusive relationship but is out of the relationship and with someone better, and I would like to use storytelling to raise awareness of relationship/domestic abuse.

I hope to have my first pitch deck and script ready by year's end so I am VERY glad I came across your post. Thanks for sharing!! Those rejections do hit hard. But, as they say, "one person's trash is another person's treasure."

Thank you, Deborah and Kevin.

How did it happen? If it involved something like abuse or stalking maybe you could raise awareness for the issues.

It would be helpful if Stage 32 could give its clients some numbers from the past "paid" pitches from the writers: how many pitches were submitted? How many "reads" requested? How many meetings from the "reads" requested? And, how many "No Responses" at all? It would seem to me that if you paid for a pitch, you should at least receive some kind of response in a timely manner and at least be made aware of the odds

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Colleen Aycock I totally agree. In fact, I plan to publish my findings in August as I just joined here not too long ago and have paid for several pitches in July. Currently, I have received only one response. So It will be interesting to see what transpires and what the percentage is. I'm quite comfortable in pitching but I would love to hear feedback sooner rather than later. I also have had two sessions where my time was shortened and I feel that there could be a built in time slot break for the pitch sessions somewhere in the middle in case of tech issues or others going long. Long story endless: I will be publishing my findings in a few weeks.

Hi Susan and Colleen, I'm surprised to read this. I always got the responses on time from my pitches here. Although, I have not pitched in a few months. Stage 32 also notifies the community on a weekly basis how many requests there were for meetings and full script.

Hi Mark! I think it's all subjective. You never really know why they don't like it and pass on it. I just pitched mine and received 2 lines of very positive feedback but it was a hard PASS but no reason as to why. Anyway, congrats with yours! All you need is one person to like it. Keep us posted!

Hey Susan Kelejian and everyone! This definitely comes up on the platform and in the community periodically, and its a good discussion to have. As to the why, Christine Capone is spot on. There really is no why for the most part. It really is an intangible thing that is best articulated as "it just wasn't for me", as broad and as vague as that might sound. It might be a very well crafted pitch with a solid hook and all of those good things, but there just needs to be that spark between the writer, the pitch and the exec. It's impossible to predict, and I still hit this same wall when I take projects that I am producing out to buyers. You just need to move on from that no and pitch the next person and the next person and so on. As for the getting the feedback itself, I can tall you that I spend my days, all day every day, and even on the weekends, talking with execs, pushing out our writers' material and working around their schedules to ensure we get pitch feedback in timely fashion. Our team meets several times every week, we are in nearly constant contact, pushing our writers to get read, and following up for everyone's work who is outstanding. As for the length, we chose 8 minutes for a reason. We are partners with the Pitch Conference at AFM and they give their pitchers 2 minutes, we built our sessions to be 8 minutes, which is to allow additional time than 2 minute pitches. I've been a producer for over 2 decades and those first 2 minutes are crucial, so we allow for some additional time to really work out the pitch. Please know that we are out there doing our best to ensure a great experience for you all, and we're always working to fine tune our processes to everyone's benefit. Hope that helps!

Hey Mark... For the longest, the great Babe Ruth was baseball's home run king - and those are the exploits for which he is remembered - but he also had the most strikeouts. You just gotta keep taking your swings at the plate man.

As an Actor, over the years and after tons of auditions where you DON'T get the job, you realize that unless you absolutely SUCK LOL, being told 'no' can happen for a million different reasons - most of which you have zero control over. Sometimes it's as simple as we're selling Pepsi and 'they' were looking for grapefruit juice. :-)

As far as the 'no' that happens with pitching projects, once you're sure that what you're selling is in REALLY good shape, when I get a pass/no, I read/listen to the critique and try to stay as objective as possible... and those things that really resonate (i.e. 'feel' or 'sound' true) I take to heart and/or if/when I hear the same concern from more than 1 person, I feel like there may be an issue for me to address.

But the rest of the time (shrug) NEXT!! LOL

So many CLASSIC movies and TV shows got passed over for YEARS before the 'right' person heard the pitch/read the script at the 'right' time. Our projects are no different.

Keep taking your swings baby! E

The pitch sessions on S32 are for educational purposes and not for access to producers who are actually looking to produce anything.

I wish they were for educational purposes. I think the readers should list the strengths and weaknesses, what can be improved, why they're not asking for the script, etc. I've had someone tell me there were several spelling errors and the story was depressing. It was a one sentence response.

I don't mind pitching on Stage 32. I do it purely as a learning process with no expectations. Having expectations can mess you up.

Shadow Dragu-Mihai, Esq., Ipg "Wow, I thought the goal was to connect with professionals in the industry who are showcasing their credentials because they're seeking new opportunities or talent. Isn’t that the purpose?"

Chase Cysco The main purpose of the Pitch Sessions is to get feedback to improve your pitch, but sometimes the executives, managers, etc. will request scripts, sign writers, etc. (www.stage32.com/scriptservices/success-stories).

Maurice Vaughan ok cool ... i like that , at least if something is good theres still some chance for opportunity ( :

Sardia Robinson A word! Preach!

Hey Chase Cysco, that's absolutely correct, if the exec hears something they like, they can always request the script and/or a meeting. Maurice Vaughan worded it perfectly in the comment above!

Im happy you posted this because I have had some strange and irritating situations in pitches on Stage32. In 4 different pitches I was told "I'm going to fill out the paperwork on stage32 and request your script to read. Its interesting and original, etc." Then the pitch feedback comes back and its always the opposite of what they said in the pitch and then they pass. I'm not really sure why this is happening. Also, I had one woman who listened to my pitch, was incredibly rude, then left feedback that was completely wrong, stating that questions she asked weren't answered when they were. So, either she wasn't listening or she didn't understand it. She then said that "No one cares about the lives of women over 40, maybe you should make them all in their 20s." Then she closed her review with, "Can't wait to pass on your next script." That was just shitty to be shitty.

Maria Brogna What!?! OMG how horrible on several accounts. I do hope you filled out the survey they send and report this. This has not been my experience here (yet) and I will be posting about my pitches and stats next week. In the case of the last exec, in my opinion there is absolutely no room for that here and I believe the powers that be would take that to heart. I wish I knew who it was because I would give her my piece of mind re: the "women over 40 line. " Just BS. I guess nobody watched Grace and Frankie. Not.

Maria...well, there's shitty and then there's your pitch review that redefines the term. As for woman over 40....I have a script in the hands of a production company right now. When we meet the female protagonist, she's in her 70s. The story traces her on and off 50 year love affair with the man she regards as the "love of her life". Oh, yeah, when we first meet him, he's also in his 70s. Don't get your nose too bent out of joint over one review. Know your story. Do what you can to improve it and keep moving forward.

Susan Kelejian she was one of my first and I almost decided not to bother pitching anymore. For me, I just like writing stories in this format because its fast and dialogue is so fun to work with. But i did purchase other pitches and the majority are very kind and help me to make my next pitch even better. But, I do find it bad form to tell me in the pitch they will be requesting my script and then in a couple days pass in review. But, thats the game I guess. I did fill out reviews, but I only reviewed the people who were professional. I wanted to make sure they stay with Stage32. And I haven't seen that "girl" back on the pitch page.

Colleen Aycock/Susan Kelejian...had to be six months ago, myself and two like minded members...DT Houston and Anthony Murphy asked the same questions about pitch results/statistics. Sure, we get raw numbers...72 requests out of how many submissions, verbal and written? My background is in marketing and those numbers matter in assessing anyone's probability of success. If you believe in your story and your ability to pitch...which I do....it most likely wouldn't dissuade you. Still, I'd like to know the odds built into the potential success of my $35 investment. I won't say we were stonewalled but the fact you guys are bringing it up again means I'm not the only skeptic on here.

It is all so subjective - BUT it had to be frustrating to hear they would ask for the script and then pass. Maybe they were looking for a certain genre and passed? But the comment about age was ridiculous when "Golden Girls" is still on television and more movies about older women continue to be released. I hope you find the "right fit" and move forward.

I'll just count my wins & be grateful for that. And hope others reach their goals too.

That's the ticket Maria. Ignore the noise.

I would like to nip something in the bud here. I think there's a HUGE misconception on this post about what a "pass" means on a pitch or coverage. It doesn't mean your work is not good. It doesn't mean your work is not worthy. It just means your work is not for that person. Ego has no place in pitches or coverage, and I know that's a violation of human nature. It's hard to put your work out there and watch someone who doesn't know your heart be critical. But it's not to discredit you or your work. It just means that for that writer and their resources at the time, they can't see it through to being a successful project. So sometimes a pass is a compliment. Sometimes it's a reader telling a writer that they think their work is so good, that they don't want to take it on as a project without giving it all they've got. Keep in mind...there's a reason why it's called SELF esteem. It's not a reader's job to tell you you're good enough. Because you were before and you will be after. Also keep in mind that networking is important, and that even when you're not networking, you're networking. And there's no industry where that's more the case than in Entertainment.

Being in business as a writer for over 25 years I understand the difference between professionalism & rude, unprofessional behavior. And what I experienced during that pitch & after was unbelievably rude, nasty and childish arrogance. Also, when someone tells you in a pitch they are going to request to read then flip flops it's frustrating, but has no bearing on my self esteem. The business person in me comes out & I find it disappointing and a wee bit of a red flag. Also, in these pitches a pass means they don't even recommend your project be read by anyone else. Which can be can be confusing when the pitch itself seemed to go exceedingly well. No one on this thread seemed to take anything personal, nor rely on a reader (Ironic when they don't actually read) for anything other than the pitch. I'm not really sure where in the thread that was confusing.